I am going to go down through your points because it helps me to organize my thoughts.
I love you already!
I agree with just about everything you say. You and I are seeing the same and different things all going on at once. And I believe that they are all there. I would never say that one particular scene only means (fill in the blank) or that when Ennis said "x" he only meant "y." Every line and every scene has multiple layers. I’m just pulling out those things that I think are significant to follow a thread through the film. You're doing the same thing. This is what I like about this film.
Anyway, a couple of points just for clarification...
As a brief prelude .... I think I understand Jack's psyche better than Ennis'. Most of my thoughts come from the viewpoint of empathy for Jack.
I understand this. Most people either take an Ennis view or a Jack view. I was Ennis for a good while, then I realized how I was shortchanging Jack and I pushed myself to look at everything from Jack’s point of view. Then both of them. Back here, over there, all around everywhere... So today I'd have to say I'm not an Ennis or a Jack, I'm both.
I see Jack's initiation as one of vulnerability. He carefully takes Ennis' hand and puts it on his cock.
I can see vulnerability here. But taking a guy's hand and putting it "you know where"
is overt.
IMO, the SNIT is when they both knew they loved each other (albeit Ennis could not admit that until 20 years later when it was too late).
I think we see something similar here... but here, really well-defined terminology is important. I can go with "they each fell in love" here. But that's different from "they each knew they had fallen in love" and it's different from "each boy knew that the other guy loved him."
You've given (in a couple of places in your post) some examples of loving behaviors between them (as I have done in my post(s)). Each of them displaying loving behaviors is consistent with "they each fell in love" but it is not necessarily consistent with "they each knew they had fallen in love" or with "each boy knew that the other guy loved him." I don’t believe it’s correct to say that Ennis knew he loved Jack and then also to say that Ennis could not admit it. It seems more consistent with the character developed in the film that Ennis did not understand what it was that was between the two of them. To Ennis, love was a man and a woman getting married. He didn’t understand that's it's not what one does on the surface, it's what one feels under the surface (example – the three options he gave to Jack at the final lake scene, contrasted with Cassie picking up on that and explaining it to him in the bus depot). This was his big internal conflict -- always wanting to see Jack and do for Jack, but being unable to understand why.
They have the freedom of the mountain to explore and develop their love for each other.
Ummmmm... yes, they have the freedom to do this, and they do explore and develop their relationship (which is friendship and sexual)... but I can't tack on "their love for each other" because they don't understand their relationship this way. WE, the viewers, understand it this way. But the film does not portray them as understanding it this way. That's one of the key plots of the film -- Ennis' inability to understand and process his feelings for Jack, his inability to correctly name those feelings.
BBM symolized freedom from societal constraints. Annie says in her short story (and I think it sums up their experience on the mountain beautifully):
" .... only the two of them on the mountain, lying in a euphoric, bitter air, looking down on the hawk's back and the crawling lights of the vehicles on the plain below, suspended from ordinary affairs and distant from tame ranch dogs barking in the dark hours. They believed themselves invisible ....
Once they came down, societal mores were present. Ennis would have married Alma no matter what. Why? Because that was the expectation ... from society and himself.
Yes and no. The reason they parted as they did is because of a failure to communicate, a failure to seek closure. Had they done that, things could have been different. As I said before, it's not that Ennis would have agreed to live together, but he was at his most vulnerable and he was at his most needy at that time. In his position, at that time, he could have made a different choice and that different choice is not limited to only one option, them living together, it could be as simple as deciding not to marry Alma.
Jack is initiating his desire to be with Ennis when he asks, "Are you going to do this again next summer?" Again, Ennis rejects Jack. When Ennis says, "How about you?" Jack says, in a vulnerable way, "I might be back. If the army don't get me." The pain in Jack's face is palpable.
Exactly. We know what Jack wanted. But Jack was confused about what ENNIS wanted. And Jack failed to take the lead here in a meaningful way that would have gotten them talking.
Ennis wished he would have never let Jack out of his sight, that is true. Ennis breaks down when he sees Jack leave and tries really hard to convince himself that he should not have these feelings for a man (i.e. Jack).
Yep.
But I don't think the outcome would have been any different. Ennis was too homophobic. Consider when Jack drives 14 hours to see Ennis after the divorce (in one of the most painful scenes of this film). Ennis is using excuses of his daily life, but his true motivation is evidenced when the truck drives by. He is fearful that someone will figure out that this man he is talking to is also his lover. Again, this scene represents another rejection.
But these are two different scenes. In the first, Ennis is at his most vulnerable and without the excuses of marriage, children and job. In the second, Ennis is not at his most vulnerable because he has the excuses of his children and his job (and just before this, he had the excuse of his marriage).
This is another point in which I have a divergent opinion. I don't think Ennis' fears would have ever been dealt with. The image of Earl was branded in his mind. That recollection is the ghost in the room ... it is always there. The mountains symbolized a way for him to escape that fear ... to believe he and Jack were "invisible". To have any kind of a life together outside of the realms of the mountainside would have been impossible for Ennis.
And yet they did have a kind of life together outside of the realms of the mountain. They saw each other 2-3 times a year for many years. That is one kind of life (a pretty sucky one, but Ennis sure seemed comfortable with it for quite a while – in fact, so did Jack until the post-divorce truck scene). Also, note that I did not say that Ennis' fears would have been dealt with on that one day at the truck, in fact, I said the opposite. I said that had Jack taken the lead to help Ennis to not make the choice to marry Alma, the kind of life that they had post-mountain (and they did have a kind of life post-mountain) could have been different and they could have dealt with Ennis' fear... day after day... year after year... I think we do agree that Ennis came to some kind of escape from his fear by the very end trailer scene... he certainly was able to deal with OMT... and so he could have come to that same point, but without the whole Alma, marriage, kids life that he chose to live because he was confused about what Jack felt for him, and he was confused because Jack failed to take the lead.
I don't know, however, that either one of them was in it for "fun" or for the sex.
I may have worded this part poorly. I don’t believe that either of them was IN it FOR fun and sex. I believe that that's how Ennis compartmentalized his relationship with Jack. He didn’t file it under “love.” He filed it under “fun” and “sex.” But WE know that he misfiled it because WE know that what they had between the two of them was love. But had Ennis known that, he wouldn’t have misfiled it. He was a stickler for detail. He just wasn’t at a point in his emotional development to understand the details he was a part of.
Had it only been that, Ennis and Jack would have quit each other long before. The truth was that each one "completed" and understood the other (the whole yin yang concept) in a way they found with nobody else.
First part, yes. Second part, no. I agree that on a spiritual level, each was the completion for the other; but, in their actual interactions with each other, neither completed the other at all. In fact, because of their failures to communicate properly all along, they disassociated each other. Remember them eating the elk? The elk is a symbol of their relationship, a poor substitute for what Jack really wanted -- soup, that is, a life together. And what did they do with the elk? They ate it up, bit by bit until it was all gone. The scene of them shooting the elk was significant for us to see Ennis providing for Jack (the text) and for us to see the poor substitute it was for Jack (the metaphor). Now that we know that they shot the elk, we have no need to see them eat it. But we do. Why? Because they're hungry (the text) and because they're eating away at their relationship (the metaphor).
(It's also interesting to note exactly where in the film we see evidence of the elk meat. In the eating scene we see elk meat hanging on a rack they built for it. And we see this same rack later on. But when has all the elk meat disappeared? And what happens right after that?)
They were each other's one-in-a-lifetime love (or soul mates, if you will). Jack goes to Mexico out of frustration and need. He beds down with Randall for the same reason (OT - notice how Jack reacts when Randall is talking to him. IMO, he is thinking of Ennis at that moment .... missing him so much that he "can hardly stand it."). At any time, if Ennis would have said the word, Jack would have dropped everything and everyone to be with the man he loved. Despite all of the times Ennis said "no", Jack kept trying. It is the final lake scene where I see Jack as resolved to the fact that he and Ennis will never have the life together that he had hoped for ("after all this time you never found anyone else to marry?") (OT - it is clear, at least for Ennis, that it is okay that each one has sex with women. Where Ennis draws the line is having sex with other men. That is why the whole "Mexico" revelation is so devasting to Ennis. He gave himself to Jack only - literaly and figuratively.)
Yep, yep and yep. But we have to ask why Ennis always said "no." The text is because of his marriage, his daughters and his job (and they are valid reasons), but the subtext is his fear of his homosexuality and its consequences. Similarly, we have to ask why it's OK to have sex with women, but not with men. And again, the subtext is his fear of his homosexuality and it consequences. If Jack is queer, that makes Ennis queer, and that's his fear. Fear is what controls Ennis. His sexual needs and desires are not his controlling factors. For Jack, they are big factors in what drives Jack. Jack said they're different. Ennis could make it, but Jack could not, on a couple of high altitude fs every year.
When Ennis blames Jack for being the "way" he is .... he is denying his own sexuality. He is trying to come to grips that he loves this man. The reality is, it isn't Jack's fault or Ennis'. It is that they love each other and have no way to deal with it.
Exactly! And I'm not sure if by "fault" you’re referring to my comment about Jack failing Ennis at the truck, but if you are, I'm not saying that Jack's failure at that moment was the whole fault behind all of their problems over the years. I'm saying that Ennis' fears are behind their problems, as the most significant factor, and that Jack had the opportunity to catch Ennis at his most vulnerable and to ameliorate those fears... or at least to begin the process... but he failed to recognize the opportunity.
When Ennis said that he hadn't yet had the opportunity, the text is that he hadn't yet had the opportunity to be a sinner, the subtext is that he was a virgin, and the symbolism is that of the (missed) opportunity that lay ahead for them, for their future.
I completely agree with this statement. Finding those shirts is another heart wrenching scene. Later, when Ennis says, "Jack, I swear ....." he is vowing his love for Jack ... almost a wedding vow. How painful and lonely. Why so late? "If only .... "
I don’t want to quibble over this interpretation because I think it's valid. I do take it a little differently, though. If we're going to pick out "vows" I’d have to go with the "We ain't queer" scene. Here they set up the parameters for their relationship and define themselves (albeit incorrectly, as Jack later determines at the post-divorce truck scene). I think that the "I swear" scene (after Junior leaves) is more of an indication to us that Ennis has now, after twenty years, come to the same realization about their vows that Jack did, that they were based on a lie. And so, "I swear" certainly could be a new and more honest affirmation of their vows from Ennis.
Now I have written a long winded response. I felt compelled to respond .... don't know why, I just did (as evidenced by my staying up until the crack of dawn knowing I needed to get up a few hours later).
No one will ever accuse me of being short-winded. Personally, I'd rather have one long, detailed, well-articulated response than 100 short one-liners (such as "I disagree," or "In your opinion," or "Whatever!") Thanks and cheers to you my BBB!
