Author Topic: I just realised why Cowboys don't dance with their wives!  (Read 19260 times)

Offline maggiesmommy GayLee

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Re: I just realised why Cowboys don't dance with their wives!
« Reply #20 on: May 17, 2006, 10:29:02 am »

let me add a post preface, if you will...
I was a senior in high school in 1963. (oh, lord, i'm so old) i know the mindset...there were the girls who slept with anyone and everyone...they were the "class punchs" very popular with the football team...we considered then pretty low class, but they always had a DATE!!  the rest of us were pretty tame by today's comaprison..i am from Kansas, also in the bible belt...and yes, aobrtion was legal...but let me tell you, if Laureen's dad was ANYTHING like mine..he would have knocked me six ways from sunday if i had gotten pg, to say nothing of needing an abortion...you barley SAID the word!!..back then you were afraid your parents were gonna "kill"
 you if you deviated with the strict moral code of that region and time..you would have been kicked out of church, out of high school, probably out of your house...just because abortion was legal didn't mean everyone was getting them..back then they were akin to suicide...my dad told me what race i could date (only MINE, of course) what religion (MINE, of course) what social class (MINE of course)...and on and on...it was a time of extreme prejudice...the race riots were going on her in the US and everyone that was in the colset was staying there...
so with this perspective I see it this way:
Laureen was indeed a spoiled little rich girl..but she was a trampy rich girl...she got it on in the backseat of cars with perfect strangers!! that was NOT done by NICE girls in the 60's...i think she wanted jack because he was safe...gave her an appearance of being the all amercian 60"s girl vision of life... get married and have babies...if you weren't married...well....back then in most circles you were laughed at behind your back if you were an unmarried old maid at 23 or 24...couple that with trying to meet her fathers expectations and i assume by the little we know about him that they were very high... keeping up appearences was vbery important in his class and social circle back then...and maybe she saw in jack as someone her father WOULD disapprove of and chose him to tick her father off, but he couldn't control this because of the pregnancy...it was either have an unwed daughter or put up with jack...just IMO, but i believe the father could tell that jack was "different", the gay radar was pretty strong then...and the word gay wasn't used much as i remember..it wa pretty hateful words that were used...so, he knew something was up, at least he thought jack was someone to be ridiculed and laughed at...hell, the whole town probably felt the same way..there was certainly disdane in the eyse of the father and his cronies...i still wonder if he had finally had enough ribbing about hs son-in-law (and i KNOW that he got it) and had the deed done himself....
anyway...Laureen wanted a marriage of convenience and she got it...she probably didn' t even have to have a "headache" very often, cuz jack probably lost interest in her sexually pretty early on.....
SO....that is my take on the 60's  and Jack and his marriage and i really think Laureen was a pretty tacky little texas tramp. birth contolw wasn't easiy to come by back then either, (even if she had had the brains to use it),so the way she was behaving she could have gotten pregnant by anyone at any time... and not even know who it was...she just and found a SAFE scapegoat...and married him..
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Offline Kd5000

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Re: I just realised why Cowboys don't dance with their wives!
« Reply #21 on: May 17, 2006, 10:32:09 am »
Well I just thought that Lureen probably moved in a higher tier social orbit and learned how to dance. Dancing wasn't probably too big in Jack's adolescene. He was more into learning how to rodeo, not dance.  Hangin out at "honky-tonks" where you drink, but certainly don't dance.

Soriety life at SMU?? Good lord, the South's social registrey school. You bet she knew how to dance before she got into the soriety. 

Don't alot of women say that about husbands not wanting to dance with their wives. I mean, when there is  courtin' to be done, the husband to be is usually quite socially engaging.

The shotgun is a good thought.  I can't imagine any other reason for there marriage.  The father could always threaten her with a cutoff is she marries "Rodeo," but if pregnancy is involved, that's a different equation.

And I really think Lureen would be in denial about her husband's sexual orientation as she's already disappointed in her latter years with Jack and has put her energy into running the business.  To think I married a gay guy would be too much.

Offline Front-Ranger

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Re: I just realised why Cowboys don't dance with their wives!
« Reply #22 on: May 17, 2006, 10:40:06 am »
Ray is that why u wear a mop on yr head, so yll have more of "those thoughts"? Then, don't take it off, cause I think u are right on! While reading yr post and the replies, I remembered vividly the look Lureen gives Jack right after he says, "Fast or slow..." and it could have meant "Yippee, here's a father for my unborn child" like Gay suggests or "Here's a guy who will go along with my agenda" or something like that. And I agree, she was always rather cold and self-absorbed. So in the phone conversation at the end, she was just business as usual (Hello...hello...who is this.") a little like Ennis himself is, but then when Ennis himself is honest and forthcoming for a change it's unnerving to her cause she has always hid this knowledge under her hat, even from herself, and here this guy is phoning her up and lifting up the hat so to speak. So, yes, I agree w/you and now I have to go throw the CD on again and look at it in a whole new light!
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Offline ednbarby

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Re: I just realised why Cowboys don't dance with their wives!
« Reply #23 on: May 17, 2006, 10:52:55 am »
Ooh.  I'll jump into the pool hip-deep.

Here's what always confounds me just a little.  First of all, I agree with you, Ray, that Lureen is certainly onto something when she says "Huuusbands...  Don't never seem to wanna dance with their wives.  Why do ya think that is, Jack?"  And yes, I think Jack knows she's onto something and so whisks LaShawn away from the table, not to playfully spite his wife, but to distract her from what she may be getting more and more onto.

Back to what confounds me (yes, I remember!)  When Ennis first calls her and says "This is Ennis Del Mar," she doesn't quite have the true recognition of what he meant to Jack yet.  She says, "You're that hunting buddy, or fishin' buddy, I know that.  I'da called ya to tell you what happened, but Jack kept his friends' addresses in his head."  So there, she's lumping him in with any of Jack's other friends.  THEN, he says, "Me an' Jack - we herded sheep up on Brokeback Mountain in the summer of '63."  RIGHT THERE.  That's when she knows.  Because Jack said it was his "favorite place."  She thought it was maybe make-believe, or a place to go drink.  After all, Jack drank a lot...  Right there is where she puts 2 and 2 together.

So does it follow that she always suspected it was a man and not a woman he loved more than he could ever possibly love her?  In a way, yes, I think so.  Otherwise that epiphany wouldn't have come so swiftly.  It only took a moment for it all to click.  I guess I picture her always feeling Jack's indifference and wondering is it me, or is there someone else?  When you start to think of the possibility of someone else, you start to watch your husband's interactions with women very closely.  Is it her?  Is it her?  Is it someone like her?  I think of Lureen watching this and realizing that Jack doesn't seem to show the least bit of interest in other women.  But he talks about that Brokeback Mountain all the time.  How he spent the best summer of his life there once.  How he wishes he could get back up there someday.  All the time.  He goes on all those fishing trips, but he never goes to Brokeback when he does.  Or so he says.  Hmmmmmmm...  And I can see him never mentioning Ennis by name to Lureen, because let's face it, you don't do that when you're in love with that person.  You're afraid your face or voice will betray you when you say his or her name.  So you don't.  Hence her not putting the pieces together yet just from Ennis saying, "This is Ennis Del Mar."  But he mentions that mountain, and BLAMMO.

I love Lureen.  I think she adored Jack and it broke her heart that she could never have him the way she wanted, similarly to how he could never have Ennis the way he wanted.  We know she loves him by that comisserating look when L.D. says Bobby is the spittin' image of his grandpa and by the little smile when he finally stands up to the son of a bitch.  I think Jack very simply married her for her money because he was tired of being dirt poor and because he didn't want to keep being vulnerable to the Aguirres and Jimbos of the world - he thought marrying her could save him from both of those fates.  But she married him because she loved him the moment she laid eyes on him.  Hell.  Who wouldn't?
« Last Edit: May 17, 2006, 10:55:58 am by ednbarby »
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Offline j.U.d.E.

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Re: I just realised why Cowboys don't dance with their wives!
« Reply #24 on: May 17, 2006, 10:57:59 am »
Quote
Here's what always confounds me just a little.  First of all, I agree with you, Ray, that Lureen is certainly onto something when she says "Huuusbands...  Don't never seem to wanna dance with their wives.  Why do ya think that is, Jack?"  And yes, I think Jack knows she's onto something and so whisks LaShawn away from the table, not to playfully spite his wife, but to distract her from what she may be getting more and more onto.
I have to watch that scene again!! I think, you are all right. I too, think Lureen 'knew' something.. At that point, she could even have considered 'warning' LaShawn about Randall... hmm.. But I guess that was out of the question  :-X

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Offline maggiesmommy GayLee

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Re: I just realised why Cowboys don't dance with their wives!
« Reply #25 on: May 17, 2006, 11:13:59 am »
I wonder if "dance with their wives" was really code for have sex with....

and sorry, they did not love each other....they BOTH knew that, and were ok with it...they just resolved to have a marriage of convenience, it worked for both of them and they just kept up pretenses, each for their own reasons...this is not critical of wither of them, just the way it was...you can see in Jack's eyes the haunted look of a man who DOES NOT "love the one he is with"...
It is not the Number of Breaths We Take that number our days
Rather the Moments that Take our Breath Away

Offline Ray

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Re: I just realised why Cowboys don't dance with their wives!
« Reply #26 on: May 17, 2006, 11:24:22 am »
Quote
and sorry, they did not love each other....

I think they had A love for one another.  Jack still kissed his wife goodbye, and on the lips where as Ennis pretty gave up kissing Alma as soon as Jack reappeared after four years.



Ray, have you started the healing process yet?

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I'll always be in the healing process for something Jude, but to what are you refering to in this instance?  :-\
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Offline Jeff Wrangler

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Re: I just realised why Cowboys don't dance with their wives!
« Reply #27 on: May 17, 2006, 11:29:18 am »
Oh, yeah, "dance with their wives" is definitely code for "have sex with." Or so I read it.

BTW, maggiesmommy, thanks for your earlier post about being a young girl in the Bible belt in the '60s. Being a boy from the Northeast, I appreciate your confirmation that my understanding of Lureen's social situation is pretty much accurate.

Barb, as usual that was one of your wonderful, thoughtful, insightful posts. I've felt the same way as you about that dawn of recognition for Lureen when she finds out that Brokeback Mountain really is a "real" place.

Now, I've got to get back to work!!!!
"It is required of every man that the spirit within him should walk abroad among his fellow-men, and travel far and wide."--Charles Dickens.

Offline ednbarby

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Re: I just realised why Cowboys don't dance with their wives!
« Reply #28 on: May 17, 2006, 11:30:19 am »
Something else that strikes me in regards to this - when Jack tells Ennis that Lureen's great at making hard business deals, but that where their marriage is concerned, they might as well do it over the phone, he's seeming to imply (and probably meaning to) that that's more her fault than his.  But we of course know better.
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Offline maggiesmommy GayLee

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Re: I just realised why Cowboys don't dance with their wives!
« Reply #29 on: May 17, 2006, 12:34:20 pm »
i agree with that, Ray,,I would call it mutual need...only they knew about their situation and that gave them something private between themselves, which can lead to a certain "connection" between two people, plus the child that they shared...but love in the truest sense...no....
It is not the Number of Breaths We Take that number our days
Rather the Moments that Take our Breath Away