what do you believe?

[forsythia12]

i thought maybe we could start a thread, (not sure if it's been done yet, and sorry if it has)  about our religious beliefs, or lack there of, and relate it to bbm.  is anyone a christian on the board?  or any other religion?  has bbm changed your mind about anything?  do you struggle with what you believe vs. what you loved about the movie.  i thought this would be interesting since even jack and ennis talked about what religious beliefs they grew up with, and how they felt about it as adults.
what about non-religious people.  have you been turned off because of the church's prejudices or peoples attitudes?
i don't wish to get into heated debates........just wondering what you all think, and maybe we could learn about each other in a peacefull way, or express our beliefs without judgement.
in college, i took relgious studies, and we had open discussions everyday.  we had so many different beleifs in that small room, and with 30 of us, it was the most interesting conversation i've ever been part of.
anyone want to add to this, or pose a question up for discussion?

[mvansand76]

I don't believe in God. I guess that makes me an atheist. In the light of Heath's death I have a hard time when I hear people say "Rest in peace, Heath, you're in a better place now" because what place could ever be better for Heath to be in than with Matilda? I also find it very hard to stomach when people say "God must have had bigger plans for him", because how selfish would it be for a God to take away the father from a 2 year old child, what other purpose would come higher than the purpose of a father to raise his child and see her grow up into a mature woman? But... I also understand that this is something that is comforting to cling to and I do believe that there is more. I do believe that Heath will be his girl's guardian angel and watch her whenever he can. So I guess I don't believe in the concept of a God (and especially not one that we should fear), but I do believe in spirituality.

Mel

[souxi]

I don't believe in God. I guess that makes me an atheist. In the light of Heath's death I have a hard time when I hear people say "Rest in peace, Heath, you're in a better place now" because what place could ever be better for Heath to be in than with Matilda? I also find it very hard to stomach when people say "God must have had bigger plans for him", because how selfish would it be for a God to take away the father from a 2 year old child, what other purpose would come higher than the purpose of a father to raise his child and see her grow up into a mature woman? But... I also understand that this is something that is comforting to cling to and I do believe that there is more. I do believe that Heath will be his girl's guardian angel and watch her whenever he can. So I guess I don't believe in the concept of a God (and especially not one that we should fear), but I do believe in spirituality.

Mel

Exactly right Mel. Surely the best place for Heath to be is here, with his daughter,family and friends who love him? If God had "better plans" for him then I,m afraid God sucks, and I,m catholic by the way. I said this on another thread but I,ll repeat it here. I want to know, WHY God has to take the good ones? Why can,t he take some of the bastards in this world? There,s plenty of them to choose from. It,s just so unfair and it makes me really angry. 

[injest]

I wouldn't call you an athiest in this situations...I would call you an agnostic....that is: you believe in something, just none of the established religions...

I was raised fundementalist Pentecostal. Pretty much turned me OFF religion....I do believe there is more to the world than what we see. I just don't believe that you have to be a member of a certain church or believe a specific dogma.

[Scott6373]

I can't believe in the dogma and rigidity of organized religion.  Even the so-called liberal religious traditions are stultifying to me.

Very recently my beliefs in "God" and spirituality have been tested, but not in the way that most people might think.  Yes I am questioning the whether or not a spiritual force, a "God" does exist, but it's from the opposite pole that I had been on.  I was convinced that faith in something you may or may not ever see was foolish.  Now I find myself grasping for that spiritual center...perhaps too late, but nevertheless...it's what's happening to me.

[injest]

I don't think it is ever too late to start thinking about where you are and what your purpose is in the greater scheme of things. I have been looking at some of the Native American belief systems and the idea of a Spirit (or God) as a connecting force is comforting to me. I have been so adverse to religion for so long...

you remember that scene in Independence Day when the man said "I havent' spoken to God since the day your mother died"?? That is me. Very angry with God.

thinking of Him as the Spirit..seems to be easier for me...

less oppressive than the God of my mother and the Pentecostal religion that seems determined that we should all be in hell...

[Artiste]

I believe in the Infinity!! And humanity in That!

In that, there is no hell, we just make hell; better, to make heaven now which we can: joys and loves for all humans!!

We all know that God exists!!

I do believe in the Infinity, and think that others too, even the Atheists and Agnostics (I do not know if that is the right spelling as I can not find it in the dictionnary); that comforts me!!

It is comforting to know that I am not the only one believing in God!! And maybe having troulbles with that at times, in the ups and downs of life!! Other times are glorious as I see Love and innumerable mysteries more and more!!

Maybe I'm now more open to those mysteries again since the four who beat me up and left me for dead, etc., that did not help; on the other hand, I see that as mysteries and with the Grace and some humans (such as my mother, my brothers and my past gay lover... and others as well, their kindness and help of some too on Bettermost), I have been able to see... that: some mysteries cleared themselves to moi, yes to me and I feel humble and know better my tasks for love on Earth as well as in Heaven now... and that Heaven starts on this Beautiful Earth!!

To me, Heaven starts here on Earth; I have no douibt about that too!! To my own experiences and that of others!!

I seek humilité/ humility??  Is it humbleness, is it ??

I try more and more for ouverture in French / openness, opening, outbreak, overture, width, span, etc., I guess; and to be disponible (to use the French word, I guess that's available in English).

That helps me. Maybe that is why I am attached to Annie's story and the BM movie?? Maybe, that helps someone:
openess and availablity!!

As First Nation, open and available to Mother Earth and Father Spirit!!

At times one is not that open nor available, so one laches-yells-faults temporarily dire labours out - I guess, (like I told off a sister-in-law, and she accepted that even if I was wrong towards her or a bit right?? !!), at least she accepted me there and then with her openess and immediate availabilty even if I was yelling and wrong, and we became good friends since she saw me in dire times and was open to me then and made herself available to hear me, even if I was partly or totally wrong towards her!!

I believe in the Infinity and in Humanity!!

Your comments are great,

keep care!! HUGS!!

[forsythia12]

these replies are great guys.  glad you wrote your opinions.  like i've said in other threads, i'm a christian, and sometimes i question what i believe, other times i'm comfortable with it.  i think that's part of establishing who we are, and what we stand for, when we examine what we think.
watching brokeback made me grow i think.  i mean, i still have my core beliefs, but i know i'm not so black and white, and i'm thankfull for that.  i think watching brokeback made me love people more, and even made me love god more.
as far as heath's death, well, i'm not sure what to say in response.  i do believe in god, heaven, hell, and all that, so all i can do is trust that god knows  what he's doing, even when it doesn't seem right.  the bible says that his thinking is not our thinking, and if it was, he wouldn't be god, so i just trust that there's a purpose in it.  i will say though, heath obvioulsy had some difficulties, and was struggling, whether it be due to sleep deprivation, stress, or depression, he was taking various meds for his condition.  that saddens me because his death was indeed an accident....and it's a shame.  as far as where god was during this?  i don't know.  i do think we have choices, and because of that, there are consequences to our choices.  god doesn't make these choices for us, and thus, we often suffer from our own decisions.
i know this may sound like i'm talking ill of heath, and i don't want to ......i just think he wasn't in a good place, and trying to medicate his afflictions, sadly, made it worse.

i don't know if i blame god.
there are several things on this earth that happen that make me wonder why he would allow them.
and as far as believing in something we may never see, well, i guess that's what faith is.....

i do understand what you're all saying though.  i think it's really neat to get a glimpse into all your thoughts and beliefs on the issue, and i hope you keep writing.

[Wayne]

   Great thread Forsythe!!  I'll catch up with y'all soon ...     

[ifyoucantfixit]

            Well I guess it is time for me to weigh in on this issue.  I have never done so before really to
anyone, except for in general..I dont think I believe in god.  I used to from the time I was a very
small child.  I was very involved in church and held my belief as you hold a warm and comforting
blanket around you.  In times of distress or worry I would pray that gods will be able to make the outcome
a good one.  I was a good believer.  I did what I believed to be the Jesus way.  I started to notice
the judgemental ways of the people in the churches. It turned me completly off of church.  So then
I embarked on a life of spiritual connection to god on my own.  Until finally when I held a point that
I truly had to use what i had learned and put it to the test.
            The bible says when it comes to faith.
"Ask and you shall be given.  Seek and you will find."  That is as basic a statement as its possible to
read.  No misinterpretation can be made.  No i didnt get it right, there.  It is plain and straight.  Well
My brother was going thru hell.  He needed desperately to have god to cling to.  He prayed for
faith.  He prayed for solace.  He prayed for guidance.  He prayed for sanity.  I prayed for all of
that along with him....because I knew that god would give him what he had promised.  After all
god doesnt break promises right.?  Well he never received that faith or solace.  And I waas devastated
because of it.  So any god that breaks a promise.  Is no god to me...  I dont need him.  And now
I find myself deeply missing a god to pray for and rest on.  But i just can never get that faith back.
I told bro Patrick the other day.  I would love for him to pray for a very dear friend in need.  Because God and i arent on very good terms these days.  And he believes with all his mind and soul.  So
maybe he can do something where obviously i can not.
      Maybe that is too much information.  But you asked.