Jack and Alma Jr.- Parallels?

[Andrew]

I think most of the explanation of Ennis' response to his daughter's plea have been pretty well laid out.  I have to agree with Marge that a BIG factor which had not been much discussed, was the legal one.  Ennis sat there with bowed head while the judge said that custody until age eighteen went to Alma.  Alma junior is fifteen at this point.  He is a deeply fatalistic person who accepts that his life has to be lived the way the people in charge will it.  Add to this that the last person he would take on over such an issue is his former wife, with her power to spill the dark secret of his life (as he sees it).  And add that he probably believes his older daughter is better off in a two-parent home, together with her sister.  And probably thinks Alma's and Morgan's 'strictness' is a good thing, better than anything he could provide.  With his temperament and experience growing up, he expects just about any change in social relationships to be for the worst.  His self-esteem as a father figure, or as a partner in any social relationship, is non-existent.  In an paradoxical way, his knowledge that he is passable in a very few things, like his work, makes him the more unwilling to take even one step in the direction of the things he is convinced he would be terrible at.   His divorce was the last kick to whatever flimsy belief he had been trying to build that he could make passable decisions in family matters too.

EDITED to add the last sentence.

[Ellemeno]

On the subject of parallels to Jack - in getting up to get the wine out of the refrigerator, he uses the same body language as when headed toward the tent in the second tent scene - thinking a moment, then coming to a decision and pushing on his knees to get up. Done very late in the day, but in the end he does make a decision on the side of love.

Oh good one, yes, I see that.  With the 20 years added to his stiffness.

[Marge_Innavera]

And add that he probably believes his older daughter is better off in a two-parent home, together with her sister.  And probably thinks Alma's and Morgan's 'strictness' is a good thing, better than anything he could provide.  With his temperament and experience growing up, he expects just about any change in social relationships to be for the worst.  His self-esteem as a father figure, or as a partner in any social relationship, is non-existent.

One of my immediate reactions to that scene was that Junior's remark about their being "strict" can have a gazillion interpretations. This is a girl of high school age talking, and "strict" can mean not giving her as late a curfew as she'd like, or not letting her date a certain boy (not Troy, we can assume  ). I doubt it meant outright meanness or unreasonableness since she doesn't seem unhappy about her stepfather being involved in her wedding. And to a teenager, a parent who's away with work a lot might have a certain appeal. That doesn't mean she doesn't love her father or that she'd want to exploit him in some cold way; that's just her being a teenager.  I do think the biggest part of Ennis' motives there is the question of how he'd handle his trips with Jack with a teenage daughter at home, but there are legit reasons too.

One thing I didn't catch about Ennis and his daughters until multiple viewings on the DVD is an aspect of the early scene where he's trying to cope with these two crying children, one a baby and the other a toddler. He looks very tired and a bit stressed in that scene, but not really unhappy. It makes the "might-have-been" all the more sad - if there was a more accepting attitude toward homosexuality by the mid-1970s and Ennis hadn't sent Jack away in that truck scene, he probably would have been seeing a lot more of his daughters than he is.  What I picked up from those scenes was that this is a person whose nature is far more loving and protective than anyone sees, but the situation he's in and his inability to deal with it results in a quite fractured life.

[serious crayons]

I'm just catching up on this excellent thread, and others have already made some great points about why Ennis can't just buck up and overcome his childhood scarring, why he might legitimately have hesitated to let Jr. move in, etc.

My feeling is that, although Ennis certainly does have problems connecting with his loved ones, the prospect of Alma Jr. living with Ennis is a terrible idea for all concerned.

At 15, she'd be living in a shabby, isolated house in the middle of nowhere, far from her school and social life, with a single dad who is gone half the time -- as opposed to living in a stable family, with rules and limits and the company of her sister, in a house conveniently located in town. I'm sure that, in a pinch, she could have made do and even been happy in the former situation, but no way is it preferable to the latter.

I hate to keep relying on this explanation -- it's my version of the "cigar is just a cigar" argument for dismissing symbolism -- but I think this scene is there mainly as a narrative device, to set up a parallel with Jack and Ennis' situation. It's like the post-divorce scene: in turning Jack away, Ennis makes what is actually a sound and responsible decision not to ditch his daughters -- but that's not the point of the scene, the point is that he's letting Jack down. In the later scene, we're not meant to concentrate on whether Jr's moving in is really a good idea, but on the fact that Ennis is rejecting her offer to live together, just as he has rejected Jack's. That way the ending, when Ennis finally reverses the pattern, offers a sign of redemption and hope.

[Ellemeno]

Marge, you are really good at seeing things from different people's perspectives.  I just got done watching To Kill a Mockingbird, and that was one of Atticus's main points, to not judge someone til you had walked in their shoes, seen the world from their point of view. 

I don't know if you are a heavy Gyllenhallic or not, but To Kill a Mockingbird is said to be Jake's favorite book, and one of his dogs is named after Atticus, the other after Boo.

Maybe in 20 years he'll do a remake with himself in that part.

Anyway, I got a lot out of reading your posts in this thread.

[Ladyeve]

Alma, Jr. affirms love is real for Ennis.  When she told him about her up coming marriage, Ennis asks her "Does he love you?" that is the first time Ennis ever speaks the word love.  That scene alone touched my heart.   When he look away, you knew he was thinking of Jack.   Alma, Jr. and Jack, the two people who did love Ennis, even in the midst of all his torment.  They wanted him in their lives, trying to drawn him closer, never giving up on him.  He was just to full of that crippling fear, and the fact he just didn't love himself enough. IMO.