Brokeback Mountain: Our Community's Common Bond > Brokeback Mountain Open Forum
"Ennis...girls don't fall in love with fun!"
nic:
--- Quote from: whiteoutofthemoon on June 10, 2006, 12:02:20 am ---....snip...So ladies, would you have fallen for Ennis? and why, or why not?
--- End quote ---
The date thing is confusing me now too! But I have a response to the main question, & that is that I would definitely have fallen for Ennis, bigtime. Not just because of his looks but because I would have been able to tell that there was something going on under his exterior. Especially, if like Cassie, I had been able to observe him for some time. I have always fallen for people who have some major personal stuff going on with them - it draws me like a moth to a flame & sometimes gets in the way of if the relationship itself. I am desperate to find out what they are like underneath & what it is they are hiding. Ennis is a classic case.
I think this comes from the fact I am also Ennis-like in that I have an outer shell & some damaged goods underneath too, so want the reassurance & the recognition that even if you have been damaged, you are worth something & someone can/will love you etc It's also a bit of a mothering/good samaritan thing too I think, wanting to help the other person overcome their inner demons. Someitmes I think that damaged people subconscioulsy send out signals that can be picked up by this caring type of person so that they can come together. Ennis certainly wasn't looking for another relationship, although at the time he must have welcomed it in a way, as a "beard" and also to see if he could "play it straight".
I have had one relationship with a person holding themselves back where it didn't work, where I couldn't get through to them & I felt locked out. To this day, I feel selfishly frustrated that I couldn't "break" them (my "skills" were lacking or they didn't trust me enough) but also worried for them in case they never found anyone that could get through to them. For Ennis, Jack was the only one he could be free with. They didn't talk a lot but seemed to have some understanding of the other's hurts. Alma Jnr was close to Ennis because of the unconditional love between a parent and child (not so much Francine/Jenny because Alma Snr seemed to take her over).
Sorry to have gone round the house with that answer! I totally see this coloured from my own experience & the answer wasn't simple. There is also some further discussion here about the attraction of Ennis's internal strength & in the reply
http://bettermost.net/forum/index.php?topic=1953.msg37027#msg37027
serious crayons:
--- Quote from: nic on June 13, 2006, 05:27:42 am ---I would definitely have fallen for Ennis, bigtime. Not just because of his looks but because I would have been able to tell that there was something going on under his exterior.
--- End quote ---
I agree with everything you wrote, Nic. And not only would I have, I did! :-*
whiteoutofthemoon:
--- Quote from: nic on June 13, 2006, 05:27:42 am ---The date thing is confusing me now too! But I have a response to the main question, & that is that I would definitely have fallen for Ennis, bigtime. Not just because of his looks but because I would have been able to tell that there was something going on under his exterior. Especially, if like Cassie, I had been able to observe him for some time. I have always fallen for people who have some major personal stuff going on with them - it draws me like a moth to a flame & sometimes gets in the way of if the relationship itself. I am desperate to find out what they are like underneath & what it is they are hiding. Ennis is a classic case.
I think this comes from the fact I am also Ennis-like in that I have an outer shell & some damaged goods underneath too, so want the reassurance & the recognition that even if you have been damaged, you are worth something & someone can/will love you etc It's also a bit of a mothering/good samaritan thing too I think, wanting to help the other person overcome their inner demons. Someitmes I think that damaged people subconscioulsy send out signals that can be picked up by this caring type of person so that they can come together. Ennis certainly wasn't looking for another relationship, although at the time he must have welcomed it in a way, as a "beard" and also to see if he could "play it straight".
I have had one relationship with a person holding themselves back where it didn't work, where I couldn't get through to them & I felt locked out. To this day, I feel selfishly frustrated that I couldn't "break" them (my "skills" were lacking or they didn't trust me enough) but also worried for them in case they never found anyone that could get through to them. For Ennis, Jack was the only one he could be free with. They didn't talk a lot but seemed to have some understanding of the other's hurts. Alma Jnr was close to Ennis because of the unconditional love between a parent and child (not so much Francine/Jenny because Alma Snr seemed to take her over).
Sorry to have gone round the house with that answer! I totally see this coloured from my own experience & the answer wasn't simple. There is also some further discussion here about the attraction of Ennis's internal strength & in the reply
http://bettermost.net/forum/index.php?topic=1953.msg37027#msg37027
--- End quote ---
Thanks nic, that was the type of response I was looking for...... I guess I wanted a better understanding of 'what women want'...of course, that topic in itself could fill a whole library, but I can see that women, probably more so than men, have that nurturing tendency inbred in you, and that you might be attracted to that tough exterior, but inner turmoil.......if it was easy, then it wouldn't be worth it to conquer that, and that perhaps you can be the only one to help that tortured soul. It would have to be presumed that the subject of marriage came up in Cassie's and Ennis's long courtship, as he was comfortable enough to have her meet his daughter, and surely she was dropping hints, but probably got nowhere, so she had to resort to snooping around with Alma Jr, trying perhaps when she asks if Ennis is ready to settle down again, I sense that she is really asking "so...what does he say about me?".
I've always wondered too....there a lot of "good men" out there who can't seem to match up with a good woman, and yet you turn on Jerry Springer and see these fat ugly unemployed old guys with strange fetishes who have SEVERAL women fighting to the death for them..... maybe not an exact analogy to Ennis, but I guess attraction is in the eye of the beholder!
welliwont:
Hi Katherine, nic, whiteoutofthemoon:
In a nutshell, the dates in the Screenplay are wrrroonng! Over at my previous abode, there was an very extensive thread discussing tie timelines the discrepancies, etc. and a couple of people reconciled the dates as best they could. I will mayvbe be able to put my fingers on it, if I do I will post the link. It is really really long so if there is no longer a link do you think I should post it here? (I am a thread-saver, but they do not look as pretty after I have saved them...)
J
serious crayons:
Then JakeTwist, I guess my next question would be, do the dates in the actual movie make sense? For instance, it's hard to imagine Ennis carrying on a five-year relationship with Cassie, never mentioning it to Jack until it just happens to come up in conversation after five years of silence, yet then telling him about it very nonchallantly, as if it were no big secret or anything. On the other hand, Alma Jr. does seem to age a few years between their date and the last scene.
(Without reading the extremely long thread, I am perfectly willing to accept your conclusion that the screenplay dates are wrong -- I agree totally. If you remember or can excerpt any particularly interesting points, feel free to post!)
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