Brokeback Mountain: Our Community's Common Bond > Brokeback Mountain Open Forum

"It ain't right."

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tamarack:

--- Quote from: latjoreme on July 09, 2006, 12:51:51 am ---those relationships had been going on something like FOUR F'IN YEARS.
--- End quote ---

I haven't ever gotten involved in figuring out all these timelines so I have no basis for my statement, but now that it has been pointed out that there is a discrepancy it could be more of a statement about how little each of them valued these other relationships rather than the fact that they have been keeping secrets from each other. Four years, or even two, would explain, though, why Cassie was so upset at Ennis, because we never saw much reason for her to be that involved emotionally.

opinionista:
One detail that grabbed my attention are Alma, Jr's. eye color. At the scene where she asks Alma for crayons, when the peanut jars fall onto the floor and break, her eyes are blue (she's two or three years old).  But when she's older, they're brown.

Penthesilea:

--- Quote from: Mikaela on July 09, 2006, 06:09:51 am ---It's the whole "Troy and Kurt" exchange between Ennis and Junior.

Daddy, that was 2 years ago?  ???

Yes, I get that they're aiming to imply that Ennis, who was shown to previously stay in close contact with his daughter(s), was so devastated by Jack's death that he dropped off the surface of his family's earth for much more than a year. If not physically, then at least mentally.

For one, I find that somewhat hard to believe, the way Ennis's relationship with Junior has been depicted up till then.

But if I accept that they've not communicated in a long time, then I would have expected more surprise, more hints of "this is a big deal" when Junior eventually appears. If not on his part, then on hers. At the very least, I wouldn't have expected her to be exasperated, as if it's weird that he still talks about Troy - why would she be, if she was still dating Troy last time she had contact with her father? That scene outside Ennis's trailer just doesn't *look* or come across to me as the meeting of people who despite their love for each other haven't seen or heard from each other in such a long time. And therefore, to me, the whole "Troy" discussion ain't quite right.
--- End quote ---

I don't think Ennis and Junior hadn't seen each other for a long time before her visit. I think tamarack's explantaion is very good.
For me, it is a typical "parent-thing". Parents do this all the time: listening only halfways to what their teenage or adult children tell them.
Many parents of my friends are like that, my parents-in-law are like that, too.

"Kurt, Troy, Michael or what the f' is this guy's name? Was he the guy who played baseball?" -
"No, daddy, it was the other guy, and it was not  baseball, but basketball"

I heard hundreds of dialogues like this.

Mikaela:
Tamarack, Penth - your replies intriegue me. Interesting! I'd like to hear others' opinions as well.

Myself, I can't manage to think that at this point, at the denouement of the film, after the emotional sucker-punches the previous scenes subjected us to - that so much dialogue would be used simply to show us that Ennis hasn't really been paying proper attention to Junior's boyfriends. The whole Troy - Kurt exchange seems to me to be trying to convey something more deeply significant than that, especially in view of Ennis's recent loss of Jack...... If it's not saying that Ennis and Junior haven't met for all that time, at the very least it seems to say that Ennis has been so emotionally submerged in Jack's death  - hasn't been paying attention at all to what's been going on with Junior and what she's been telling him ever since Jack died or maybe before. But then I would have expected a *much* less bemused reaction from Junior.

So to me, it remains"not right" - not even as a lead-in to Ennis's later "love" question about Kurt once they're in the trailer. Upon learning that Junior is getting married, he could have asked that question with equal significance, IMO, even if he'd been aware that Junior was dating a guy named Kurt and had been doing so for some time.

Not that it's a big deal. I feel really bad, pointing out any little thing as "not right" - I love this film so much. 

Meryl:
These are all interesting examples, and I've tended to gloss over these points, too, preferring to focus on the characters, like most people.  But...

One that has always made me scratch my head is the timeline of getting camp broken down and moving the sheep down the mountain after Aguirre's second visit.  In the screenplay, much of the action seems meant to take place on different days, but as it plays in the movie, it seems to be on the same day.

We see Ennis wake up in the pup tent in the morning.  At what seems to be mid-morning of the same day, he arrives at camp, and instead of getting breakfast, he sees Jack taking down the tent.  (In the short story, this takes place the week after the big snow.)  Then, at what seems to be mid-afternoon of the same day, we have the lassoing/tussle scene, followed by a shot of them taking the sheep down the mountain.

Logically, Aguirre would not have gotten to Jack that early in the day to give him the news, and even if he did, Jack would logically wait for Ennis to show up and have breakfast before packing up. (Even if he struck the tent before breakfast, by the time they got completely packed and rode up to the sheep, it would be very late in the day to start taking them down.)  If, instead, Ennis is arriving for supper, Jack wouldn't be taking down the tent, since it would be too late in the day to get all packed up and go back to the sheep to get them going.  They would need to wait til morning.  Now, there's no reason to assume the filmmakers ever intended this to be the same day, but that's what it looks like.

In fact, the screenplay puts the two scenes (Jack telling Ennis the news and the lassoing/tussle scene) on separate days, which makes more sense.  The first scene is "Day" and the second is "Morning."   By combining Jack's taking down the tent with giving Ennis the news, it seems to me Ang cheated us out of a final Tent Scene.  >:(

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