Gays in Ancient Egypt and Other Civilizations

[Kerry]

Niankhkhnum & Khnumhotep

Were they lovers?

Were they the Ancient Egytian equivalent of Jack & Ennis?

Who were Niankhkhnum & Khnumhotep?

We know they lived during the Fifth Dynasty of the Old Kingdom in Ancient Egypt (2450-2325 BC).

We also know that even though they were both married with children, they chose to be buried together in their own tomb alone. And that the paintings on the walls of the tomb depict them embracing, holding hands and gazing into each other's eyes. And though their children are shown with them in some of the paintings, their wives are not. All of this went against every convention of the day.

www.egyptology.com/niankhkhnum_khnumhotep

Visit their tomb and see the beautiful paintings of Niankhkhnum & Khnumhotep facing Eternity together, arm in arm.

[David]

"OVERSEER OF THE MANICURISTS IN THE PALACE OF THE KING."   ?   oh yeah.


They look pretty young in the paintings.   Perhaps they were lovers and met an unfortunate fate because of that?      Nonetheless, the depictions are certainly thoughtful.

[Kerry]

"OVERSEER OF THE MANICURISTS IN THE PALACE OF THE KING."   ?   oh yeah.

Some things just don't change  At least they weren't the King's hairdressers or court choreographers . . . or window dressers at the Pyramid Shopping Mall 

[Scott6373]

I dunno...they wear too much makeup...hehehehehehe

[moremojo]

Kerry, I have read a little of these two Old Kingdom tomb-brothers (in exactly which way, we can only guess), and enjoyed seeing them referenced here. References and depictions of same-sex affection and eroticism seem virtually non-existent in ancient Egyptian civilization, at least in the fragments that have come down to us.

And yet, I remember reading a stray reference once to a Pharaoh who was regarded with scorn for his relations with one of his generals. No mention was made in my source of the Pharaoh's identity (or the general's, for that matter), and I would really appreciate learning this someday. Do you by any chance know anything of this?

[Kerry]

They look pretty young in the paintings.   Perhaps they were lovers and met an unfortunate fate because of that?     

It was never the intention of Ancient Egyptian art to photographically represent reality. Practically everything was stylised. No matter how old and disfigured you may have been when you went to meet your maker, you were always portraid as youthful and at the height of your vigour. This was primarily because the paintings in your tomb had to make you look your best when you stood before Osiris, Anubis, Isis and Nepthys, for the weighing of your heart, to determine whether or not you would progress forward to Everlasting Life. And the way you were represented in your tomb paintings (as well as how you looked in the painting on the lid of your sarcophagus) determined how you would appear in the Afterlife.

Ya gotta love those zany Egyptians! 

[David In Indy]

This may be slightly OT and if so, I apologize.

After I came out to my parents the second time (long story) my Mother sat down with me one day and told me about the Sioux attitude towards homosexuality.

Not only did the Sioux (along with a large number of other North American tribes) accept homosexuals, they elevated them; almost to a "god like" position within the tribe. The gay man (and to a lesser degree a gay woman) was seen as a "bridge" between the male and female genders. Homosexuals were called "Wink'te" which loosely means "half man" in the Lakota language. Wink'te were thought to have been sent to the tribe by Wankan Tanka (The Great Spirit or God) to heal the tribe and restore harmony and balance to the People. Wink'te were also believed to be magical because of their close association with the Great Spirit. Wink'te had the ability to commune with God, and therefore people within the tribe would ask the gay man or woman to offer up prayers on their behalf.

Wink'te were often married too. It was considered a great honor to be espoused to a wink'te. Often male wink'te would be married to a great warrior of the tribe as a reward for his bravery in defending the tribe.

Unfortunately, after the Whites arrived in North America, Christian missionaries began evangelizing to the various tribes and Native attitudes towards homosexuals took a negative turn. Today, many Native Americans have strong anti-gay feelings which almost border on homophobic. But there is a resurgence within many Native American circles to return to the old ways and traditions, including the total acceptance of gay men and women.

If you are interested, I can provide you with some internet links to more information.

Okay. Sorry about that. I find this Egyptian thread very interesting Kerry! 

[TXdoug]

VERY interesting thread, Kerry. I look forward to your posts and pictures.

[Kerry]

If you are interested, I can provide you with some internet links to more information.

Thank you for posting that interesting information, David. I remember once reading something about gays in pre-Christian Native American societies being considered spiritual link entities. Forgive me if I've got this wrong along the way, but is it true that they were often the tribal "Medicine Man"? It is my understanding that gay men within many indigenous societies around the world take on a spiritual role within their communities - as shaman, for instance.  David, I would be very interested, indeed, to read more about this fascinating subject. Kindly post the links publicly either here or at a new thread. I'm sure others here at BetterMost would be interested to read about this. You must be so very proud of your wonderful heritage, David. And I can tell how much you love your dear mother. I know very well what you are going through right now. Though it has been three years since she passed away, you still have some time to go yet, before you emerge from the dark cloud of mourning. I'm guessing you were probably 41 when you lost your Mum? My mother also died when I was 41, and can I tell you something? I still miss her every day. We were very close. She was the first person I ever told I was gay and she only gave me unconditional love in return. She was always my best friend. The cliche about time healing all wounds is correct. The edge goes off the grief, in time. And what you're left with is their love. My Mum is always with me. Always will be. I firmly believe that.

[TXdoug]

Yes, David , please post the links or better yet start a new thread about this VERY interesting area of Native American life. Posts and pictures of Native American Civilization especially your tribe and your life would be WONDERFUL. Your personal sharing  would add to this website. Also...please translate the words in your "signature" at the bottom of your posts. Thanks.