Author Topic: TOTW 15/07: Short story or movie, which one do you prefer?  (Read 19950 times)

Offline brokeplex

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Re: TOTW 15/07: Short story or movie, which one do you prefer?
« Reply #30 on: November 23, 2007, 01:42:31 pm »
Thanks brokeplex!

Right, I say to you first sentence as well as to your second one:
Do you mean that in that Jake and Heath do not resemble the descriptions of Jack and Ennis in the short story?

Or do you mean that in the movie the two actors do not show the signs of age that we would expect?
...
Even if both the book and the movie are important: Jake, I say, is too cute, as Jack! So is Heath as Ennis! That seems so according to Annie's book descriptions??

Let us start with that?? (Tackle the other sentence later, as to aging??)

Hugs!

I agree with you Artiste. The descriptions of Jack and Ennis in AP's short story are a bit different than the appearance of Jake Gyllenhaal (easily the handsomest man in the known universe!) and Heath Ledger (Jake's close runner up in the handsomness contest)

But, how does that affect the telling of the Brokeback story? Does it make the story any less believable? You have brought this up...tell me why I should care about your argument. Many movies have used very handsome men or stunningly beautiful women that do not match in appearance the description in the source story or screenplay . I can give you dozens of examples dating back to the 1920's. In all cases I believe this is done for marketing purposes. Many people will pay for a movie ticket to see an actor with a handsome face. Would you have rather seen Danny Devito and Fred Thompson cavorting up and down Brokeback Mountain?  As an ex-political consultant, I wonder just how politically catastrophic such an appearance would have been for Fred, he really couldn't screw up his campaign any more than it is already. 

Offline brokebackjack

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Re: TOTW 15/07: Short story or movie, which one do you prefer?
« Reply #31 on: November 23, 2007, 04:09:51 pm »
LMAOOO!!!
"I couldn't stand it no more so i fixed it"

Offline Brown Eyes

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Re: TOTW 15/07: Short story or movie, which one do you prefer?
« Reply #32 on: November 29, 2007, 12:30:45 pm »
Would you have rather seen Danny Devito and Fred Thompson cavorting up and down Brokeback Mountain?  As an ex-political consultant, I wonder just how politically catastrophic such an appearance would have been for Fred, he really couldn't screw up his campaign any more than it is already. 


 :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:
the world was asleep to our latent fuss - bowie

Offline Artiste

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Re: TOTW 15/07: Short story or movie, which one do you prefer?
« Reply #33 on: November 29, 2007, 08:02:37 pm »
You need both??

Or we need a continued Annie's story, in order to have also BM II ??


Hugs!

Offline brokeplex

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Re: TOTW 15/07: Short story or movie, which one do you prefer?
« Reply #34 on: November 30, 2007, 11:15:47 am »
You need both??

Or we need a continued Annie's story, in order to have also BM II ??


Hugs!

Lets euthanize the idea of a BMII, BM stands alone and should continue to stand alone. It is entirely sufficient for my heart and my imagination.

Offline Artiste

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Re: TOTW 15/07: Short story or movie, which one do you prefer?
« Reply #35 on: November 30, 2007, 11:24:27 am »
Thanks brokeplex!

I am very sad by what you say here, may I add!

Since I see that the BM movie was done by straights and I see too much gratuitous violence, anti-gay ways, etc., to murder gay men even to-day too easily, I am FOR another movie, an BM one as a second, but done by gay men, for justice this time!

Surely you can think about that... in many ways? Even if it is another story like BM I? Above all, we need movies which present real lives of gay men, so we are showed as meaningful!

Are we not human, civil, gay men we are!

Hugs!

Offline brokeplex

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Re: TOTW 15/07: Short story or movie, which one do you prefer?
« Reply #36 on: November 30, 2007, 11:33:47 am »
Thanks brokeplex!

I am very sad by what you say here, may I add!

Since I see that the BM movie was done by straights and I see too much gratuitous violence, anti-gay ways, etc., to murder gay men even to-day too easily, I am FOR another movie, an BM one as a second, but done by gay men, for justice this time!

Surely you can think about that... in many ways? Even if it is another story like BM I? Above all, we need movies which present real lives of gay men, so we are showed as meaningful!

Are we not human, civil, gay men we are!

Hugs!

I know Artiste, you believe that BM was an anti-gay movie. We disagree on this, but you make good arguments and I respect what you say - I just disagree with you.
I think BM was the first movie I have ever seen which showed any understanding of the vast numbers of closeted and semi-closeted men out there, just waiting to wake up and find their voices at long last.

hugs!

Offline Aussie Chris

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Re: TOTW 15/07: Short story or movie, which one do you prefer?
« Reply #37 on: November 30, 2007, 08:15:40 pm »

Oh come on Artiste.  Was Lassie anti-dog because she dies at the end?  Yes, BBM has gay-bashing and murder in it, but that's not what the movie is about any more than The 10 Commandments was about how to drown a thousand Egyptians in a river.  There are many (MANY) themes in BBM, but I think the most salient ones are the choices that we make out of fear and the regret that comes from living a life of denial - something that just about every gay person has intimate knowledge of.  Without a doubt, with the release of BBM came with a universal and collective sense of appreciation that someone has finally made a film that speaks the truth about what it feels like to be gay, and the lament that there is potential for so much love in the world but we use our fears (or the fears of others) to dictate our actions.

You are completely entitled to your own opinion about the story Artiste, why it was made, and the motives of the writers/producers/actors, but let me ask you this: would you say that I could not possibly understand or be moved by one of your pieces of art because I'm not an artist?  Is "getting it" dependent on either being gay, a man, or an artist?  Or is "getting it" in my own way (even if it was not your intention) equally valid and perhaps even the point of any great work of art?  Maybe it's because the film's makers were straight that it has reached so many, and gays and straights alike can be moved by it without dismissing it as gay-only message?  But the most important consideration I hold on to is this: the film makers may be straight but I seriously question any suggestion that they were not intending to make a beautiful, sad, thoughtful, and genuine film that has resulted in millions of people pausing and reflecting on how they may have denied themselves the opportunity to love.
« Last Edit: December 01, 2007, 12:48:02 pm by Penthesilea »
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Offline Oregondoggie

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Re: TOTW 15/07: Short story or movie, which one do you prefer?
« Reply #38 on: December 01, 2007, 01:22:25 am »
Well said, Aussie Chris.  Totally agree.

« Last Edit: December 01, 2007, 12:49:08 pm by Penthesilea »

Offline serious crayons

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Re: TOTW 15/07: Short story or movie, which one do you prefer?
« Reply #39 on: December 01, 2007, 03:10:34 am »
Beyond that, Artiste, I simply don't understand why you say the movie is anti-gay because it depicts violence toward gay people. The point it's making is that violence toward gay people is bad.

I've heard people say they don't love BBM because they don't want yet another movie where a gay man dies at the end. They want a happier ending, a more optimistic view of gay life, a movie where gay men aren't "punished" for being themselves. Point taken. But there's also an argument for not turning a blind eye toward history, for trying to depict gay life in the 1960s West the way it really was. Artiste, you have often rightly complained about abuse of gay men -- the movie is trying to expose the tragedy of that, not celebrate it.

To say it's anti-gay is like movies about racism are anti-black, or movies depicting Jesus' crucifixion are anti-Christ.


« Last Edit: December 01, 2007, 12:50:21 pm by Penthesilea »