"I figured you were sore from that punch"

[Meryl]

Excellent topic, and wonderful insights! 

By nakymatonAnyway, I think that there was a tension within Ennis that just hurt so much that he couldn't take it, a tension between loving Jack and feeling like he shouldn't, couldn't, mustn't. And when Jack touched him, it was too much to take... and Ennis hit, because it hurt so much and he didn't understand it and he wanted it to just stop hurting. (Like a little kid who just strikes out, hitting and biting, when he's awoken in the middle of the night with some kind of fever or tummy ache. Or like a wild animal who bites the person trying to get the barbed wire off its leg.)

This is how I see it, too.  Instinctive and irrational.  I have a cat with a "low startle point" who attacks the source of what alarms her, no matter if it makes sense or not.  Ennis reminds me of her here.

There's another thing at work, too, that makes the Jack thing different from the times Ennis strikes out at the bikers and the truck driver at the Black & Blue, IMO.  There's so much of the hurt child in Ennis's personality.  Ennis is scared of being perceived as "weak," as being in need of help or comfort.  He'd like to think that he's in control of the situation and unaffected by it all.  It's interesting that the punch comes not after the blow to the nose but after Jack's caress, Jack's perception that he was hurting.  The same happens at the Lake Scene when Ennis breaks down in tears.  The "Get the fuck off me" reaction is not the same as the "Dammit, I am not taking your crap" attacks.

[serious crayons]

It's interesting that the punch comes not after the blow to the nose but after Jack's caress, Jack's perception that he was hurting.  The same happens at the Lake Scene when Ennis breaks down in tears.  The "Get the fuck off me" reaction is not the same as the "Dammit, I am not taking your crap" attacks.

Great observation, Meryl! It makes me rethink my earlier assertion that Ennis punches Jack not because he's trying to get his emotions under control but because he's hurt that Jack doesn't seem as disappointed about leaving.

Now I think it's both. He is hurt that Jack doesn't seem as disappointed. But if that was all there was to it, he might have punched Jack sooner. Nor was the bloody nose the provocation. It was Jack's attempt to comfort and calm him that set Ennis off.

When Jack lassoes Ennis the first time, Ennis tucks in his shirt. That's what Ennis does every time he has to transition between his two "worlds" -- Jack and the rest of society -- as a way of tucking away his secrets and adjusting his mindset for wherever he's headed. So he's getting ready to go back into society, perhaps starting to bring his feelings about Jack under control. Then Jack lassoes him again. The tussle that follows is an expression of mild annoyance over the lassooing and also a desire on both sides to touch each other. The way they'd really like to touch sees off limits given the turn their moods have taken, so this is the closest they can get.

That mix of confusing emotions starts to get Ennis mad. Then the bloody nose. He's still not immediately mad enough to punch back, he stands there a moment and wipes the blood on Jack's shirt. But it's Jack's comforting that pushes him over the edge. It brings all of those wild emotions back into relief -- heartbreak about leaving Jack, hurt that Jack isn't more upset, his own struggle to prepare to go back to society and give all this up. When Jack is tender and caring it reminds him again how much he will be losing, so he lashes out.

That's echoed in the lake scene -- twice, actually. When Jack says "I did once," he is reminded of how much he'll lose if Jack leaves him, so he lashes out with the Mexico threat. And then Jack's comforting triggers the "get the fuck off me."

[fernly]

When Jack says, “You and Alma, that’s a life,” well, I can understand getting a little peeved by that remark because the only glimpse that Jack got of Ennis’s home life was that time in the entryway/kitchen. But then I remember Ennis saying at the motel, “I’m stuck with what I got here,” which is not the way you describe a life and wife you’re happy with.

I've come to think that Jack is doing some (reasonable) projecting here, cause him and Lureen, that's not much of a life. Like you said, Barb, Jack's had little reason up to this point to think that Ennis is any more happy with his life in Riverton than Jack is with his life in Childress, and plenty of reasons (all night in the motel, the day spent together, the expression on Ennis' face when he's lying there by the fire) to think that Ennis isn't.

[dly64]

I am going back to the screenplay because I think it helps (me) understand Ennis' motivation.

As an additional note, the book and screenplay indicate the bloody nose is a result of getting kneed by accident. I, however, think that the film makes it look intensional. There are also some slight differences ... In the film, Ennis hits Jack in his eye instead of his jaw and it is Ennis who has the denim shirt instead of Jack. Beyond that, I think the film and the screenplay are very close. Here are the notes:

Ennis grabs the rope and yanks hard -- Jack is pulled towards Ennis and falls, they start to wrestle. Ennis is only half-playing -- tense.

Jack is not quite fighting, either, but the mood quickly darkens, when Ennis slips, trying to avoid a hold, and Jack accidentally knees him in the nose. Blood pours, getting on both of them. Ennis jumps to his feet. Jack immediately gets up, tries to staunch the blood coming from Ennis' nose with his own shirt sleeve, and Ennis reflexively cold-cocks him hard in the jaw, causing Jack to stagger back and fall on his ass.

Jack looks up at Ennis, rubbing his jaw, too stunned to say anything.

Ennis looks down at him, wiping his bloody nose on his denim sleeve, furious and despairing all at once, more emotion stirring than he can handle.

What this indicates to me is two things:
1) Ennis' initial hit is one of impulse. Nothing unusual for him since he is shown throughout the film as having quick reflexes. He takes action without thinking anything through.
2) Ennis was unable to deal with what was happening. The main feeling he ever experienced pre-BBM was anger. Ennis was certainly not in touch with his emotions. Instead, he reverted back to what he knew best .... anger, avoidance.

[Brown Eyes]

Well, I think it's very interesting to focus on the timing of when the punch comes.  Very clever of all of you to notice that it comes during a moment of "comforting"... that's a very interesting trend to think about.  I remember someone once said that they thought Ennis got angry here because of the *second* lassoing maneuver from Jack...  The idea was that Ennis did not like feeling that out of control.  That knocking him on the ground with the lasso was enough to make him feel uncomfortably unstable/ out of control.  This seems especially true since he's just tucked his shirt-in... which definitely means he's trying to get himself under control.

I'm glad we're really discussing this scene because (well, I think it's a really difficult scene to come to terms with) and because Proulx seems to make quite a big deal about the issue of the punch.  I've now checked (since my first post) and she does mention it 3 times... and the 3 times are dispersed throughout the story.
(1) "He looked away from Jack's jaw, bruised blue from the hard punch Ennis had thrown him on the last day." - this corresponds with the truck conversation
(2) [Jack]"Yeah, that little punch a yours surprised me.  I never figured you to throw a dirty punch"- followed by the K.E. story in the motel.
(3) "The dried blood on the sleeve was his own blood, a gushing nosebleed on the last afternoon on the mountain when Jack, in their contortionistic grappling and wrestling, had slammed Ennis's nose hard with his knee.  He had staunched the blood which was everywhere, all over both of them, with his shirtsleeve, but the staunching hadn't held because Ennis had suddenly swung from the deck and laid the ministering angel out in the wild columbine, wings folded." - this comes right near the end, clearly with the discovery of the shirts.

It's remains amazing to me that this moment of hurt (Ennis's was clearly tied up in knots and agonizing during the punch scene and Jack was hurt, confused, felt rejected, etc.) turns into something so sentimental.  Even Proulx's writing evolves in a very sentimental way when describing the circumstance.

I also (again to reiterate something I mentioned in the first post) still can't quite grasp my own reaction to this whole thing.  I can't think of any other movie (and of course most certainly real life circumstances) where I'd tolerate the idea of hitting a lover so easily... Or I mean, I'm able to move past this in the film (I guess much the same way Jack is able to do this).  But, still I would normally never be able to brush such a thing off so easily. 
 

[dly64]

I'm glad we're really discussing this scene because (well, I think it's a really difficult scene to come to terms with) and because Proulx seems to make quite a big deal about the issue of the punch.  I've now checked (since my first post) and she does mention it 3 times... and the 3 times are dispersed throughout the story.
(1) "He looked away from Jack's jaw, bruised blue from the hard punch Ennis had thrown him on the last day." - this corresponds with the truck conversation
(2) [Jack]"Yeah, that little punch a yours surprised me.  I never figured you to throw a dirty punch"- followed by the K.E. story in the motel.
(3) "The dried blood on the sleeve was his own blood, a gushing nosebleed on the last afternoon on the mountain when Jack, in their contortionistic grappling and wrestling, had slammed Ennis's nose hard with his knee.  He had staunched the blood which was everywhere, all over both of them, with his shirtsleeve, but the staunching hadn't held because Ennis had suddenly swung from the deck and laid the ministering angel out in the wild columbine, wings folded." - this comes right near the end, clearly with the discovery of the shirts.

It's remains amazing to me that this moment of hurt (Ennis's was clearly tied up in knots and agonizing during the punch scene and Jack was hurt, confused, felt rejected, etc.) turns into something so sentimental.  Even Proulx's writing evolves in a very sentimental way when describing the circumstance.

I completely agree with you. I think see the shirts symbolizing two things:
1) The shirts are like "two skins, one inside the other, two in one." Almost  a metaphor of marriage ... "the two shall become one".
2) The blood - They can't quit each other. They are in each other's blood. Their love for each other is that deep.

I also (again to reiterate something I mentioned in the first post) still can't quite grasp my own reaction to this whole thing.  I can't think of any other movie (and of course most certainly real life circumstances) where I'd tolerate the idea of hitting a lover so easily... Or I mean, I'm able to move past this in the film (I guess much the same way Jack is able to do this).  But, still I would normally never be able to brush such a thing off so easily. 

I find this a bit baffling, too. However, I see Ennis as a person who can't handle his emotions. He explodes easily. He is very impulsive. Anger is the one thing he understands. I have also wondered if he hit Jack to convince himself that he had no feelings for this man. Just a thought ....

[serious crayons]

Ennis says, “Now you shut up...” and Jack looks hurt by the rebuke. I’m not sure what to think about the exchange leading up to this. When Jack says, “You and Alma, that’s a life,” well, I can understand getting a little peeved by that remark because the only glimpse that Jack got of Ennis’s home life was that time in the entryway/kitchen. But then I remember Ennis saying at the motel, “I’m stuck with what I got here,” which is not the way you describe a life and wife you’re happy with. So maybe they’re both at fault here.

Well, I don't blame Ennis here (so what else is new?) because it seems to me he is being nice to defend Alma.

[Meryl]

By Latjoreme
When Jack lassoes Ennis the first time, Ennis tucks in his shirt. That's what Ennis does every time he has to transition between his two "worlds" -- Jack and the rest of society -- as a way of tucking away his secrets and adjusting his mindset for wherever he's headed.

Good observation, Katherine!  He's "straightening up" his act.  

By goadra
It’s an interesting contrast between the moments mentioned and one of the times that Ennis does allow Jack to comfort him. After “There ain’t no reins,” Jack softly brushes Ennis’s cheek and caresses his neck--and Ennis doesn’t pull away.

I think the difference here is that, unlike the other times, Ennis feels in control.  Jack is silently acquiescing to Ennis's wanting to continue their separate lives as well as their relationship.  They are both in need of comfort.

By atz75
I remember someone once said that they thought Ennis got angry here because of the *second* lassoing maneuver from Jack...  The idea was that Ennis did not like feeling that out of control.  That knocking him on the ground with the lasso was enough to make him feel uncomfortably unstable/ out of control.  This seems especially true since he's just tucked his shirt-in... which definitely means he's trying to get himself under control.

Amanda, you've pointed up a side of Ennis that I think is key to how he deals with his fear, and that is by being controlling.  As long as he can dictate the terms of his and Jack's relationship, he feels able to handle it.  Jack puts up with the "fucking short leash" for many years before he confronts Ennis about it, and Alma puts up with his "fishing" trips in much the same way.  When Ennis senses he's not in control, like at the Lake Scene and in the Thanksgiving scene with Alma, his immediate reaction is to lash out.  Maybe this is actually what I was trying to describe earlier as the hurt child trying to prove he doesn't need comfort.

[ruthlesslyunsentimental]

I have a slightly different take on the punch.

While I agree with a lot of what has been said in the previous posts, two things are significant for me:

Latjoreme

…[Ennis] is reminded of how much he'll lose if Jack leaves him, so he lashes out with the Mexico threat.

And

Atz75

Well, I think it's very interesting to focus on the timing of when the punch comes.  Very clever of all of you to notice that it comes during a moment of "comforting"... that's a very interesting trend to think about.

I look at the punch as being completely intentional and deliberate.

It goes back to the second tent scene.  Jack waited in the tent for Ennis to choose to make a move on this night.  Jack wasn’t going to grab Ennis’ hand again.  Ennis did make his choice and walked into the tent.  What’s significant about this choice?  Ennis put aside all of his fears that had been engrained into him.  He put all of his trust in Jack.  Major steps for Ennis.

Then Jack led Ennis into lovemaking (as opposed to sex, which Ennis did quite handily, thank you very much).  And what did Ennis do? He completely and utterly melted into Jack’s arms.  He put all of his trust into Jack.

Whoosh!  Cut to the scene where Jack is taking down the tent.  What does Ennis see?  Ennis sees Jack dismantling the home that they built together, that they built by Ennis putting all of his trust into Jack.  And Ennis saw Jack taking it down nonchalantly – which we understand because we mainly agree that Jack expected the relationship to continue in some form or fashion post-mountain.

So Ennis got in a snit and went off to sit.  And he did himself some thinkin’.  As everyone seems to agree above, Ennis is confused and hurt about a lot of issues.

But the key issue I see here is that Ennis now sees (to Ennis, at least) Jack betraying the trust that Ennis put into Jack in the second tent scene and thereafter.

What is significant about Ennis’ trust?  Where does Ennis come from?  What makes Ennis tick?  He was “abandoned” by his parents’ deaths.  He was “abandoned” by his sister’s marriage.  He was “abandoned” by his brother’s marriage.  These are all people he trusted to be there for him – people he needed -- and each one “abandoned” him.  When he gave his trust to Jack, he gave Jack everything that had been taken away from himself over the past several years.  He put his trust in Jack to lead him and to be there for him.

Now, Jack is leading Ennis away from their home.  Ennis feels that he is, once again, being abandoned.  This is why I believe his punch was deliberate.  I believe Ennis is saying “You son-of-a-bitch… how dare you abandon me when I gave myself to you.”  He subjugated his fear of “queer” by putting his trust in Jack.  Now, he’s lashing out at the object, the maker or doer, of his other great fear – fear of abandonment – and that object is Jack.

[stevenedel]

Now, Jack is leading Ennis away from their home.  Ennis feels that he is, once again, being abandoned.  This is why I believe his punch was deliberate.  I believe Ennis is saying “You son-of-a-bitch… how dare you abandon me when I gave myself to you.”  He subjugated his fear of “queer” by putting his trust in Jack.  Now, he’s lashing out at the object, the maker or doer, of his other great fear – fear of abandonment – and that object is Jack.

I agree with that. Ennis's mood darkens from the very moment Jack tells him they will be going down a month early. Ennis was always the practical and dutiful one, but now he lets Jack do all the packing while he just mopes around. On BBM he has found a happiness he's never known before (and will, unfortunately, never know again ). By the time they have to leave BBM, he knows that. I think Proulx likened Ennis to a wound-up spring; you might say BBM unwound him, and when they have to go, he is winding up again. So when Jack is hurting him, he hurts him back. But in the end I think his anger has very little to do with Jack at all, or with Jack inadvertently hitting his nose - it's just his own confusion and inability to cope that he projects outward.

I must say that though, thankfully, I'm not the hitting type, I know from personal experience how intense love, once thwarted, can turn into intense anger. If circumstances force you to part from someone you love, you're still stuck with all those feelings that have to go somewhere. One defense mechanism is to turn them into their opposite. I believe psychoanalysts call this reaction-formation.