Author Topic: "If your can't fix it, Jack...You gotta stand it."  (Read 12893 times)

Offline serious crayons

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Re: "If your can't fix it, Jack...You gotta stand it."
« Reply #10 on: December 15, 2006, 03:24:03 pm »
Let me say at the outset that I agree with all your interpretations of those lines. I like to think of them as near declarations of love, along with "sending up a prayer of thanks."

But -- this movie is SO torturously ambiguous! -- they also could be interepreted as:

"If you can't fix it, Jack, you gotta stand it." (We just have to put up with society's unbreakable rules.)

"For how long?" (How long do we have to go on like this?)

"As long as we can ride it." (As long as we can handle the frustration. ) "Ain't no reins on this one." (There's no way to change the rules.)

And much as I prefer to hear it the other way, I can't entirely blot that possibility out of my mind. Jeff, is that the way you used to interpret the scene before you changed your views?

Offline nakymaton

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Re: "If your can't fix it, Jack...You gotta stand it."
« Reply #11 on: December 15, 2006, 03:34:34 pm »
Here's a link:
http://www.focusfeatures.com/viewer.php?f=brokeback_mountain&c=trailer&ext=wmv&w=480&&h=270

Ahhhh! Thank you, fernly!

*watches trailer*

Damn. I should see that movie. ;)

(I must've watched that trailer a thousand times, too. Watch trailer. Click link back to list of theaters showing movie. Watch trailer again. Search google news for stories. Check list of theaters showing the movie. Watch trailer. Repeat until unsatisfied. That was me a year ago.)
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Offline Mikaela

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Re: "If your can't fix it, Jack...You gotta stand it."
« Reply #12 on: December 15, 2006, 04:23:53 pm »
"If you can't fix it, Jack, you gotta stand it." (We just have to put up with society's unbreakable rules.)

"For how long?" (How long do we have to go on like this?)

"As long as we can ride it." (As long as we can handle the frustration. ) "Ain't no reins on this one." (There's no way to change the rules.)


I've always thought it starts out the way you write here, and then it changes. I hear the entire exchange as follows:

"If you can't fix it, Jack, you gotta stand it." (We just have to put up with society's unbreakable rules.)

"For how long?" (How long do we have to go on like this?)

"As long as we can ride it." (As long as we can manage to meet up yet take care to fly under society's and the tire iron wielders' radar. ) "Ain't no reins on this one." (There's no limit to our feelings and how we might potentially happen to act - and what we might risk - as a consequence.)


So I suppose I see those last lines of Ennis's both as a declaration of love and commitment to Jack, but simultaneously as a premonition of bad things to come of it in the end.  :'(


Quote
Damn. I should see that movie.

I haven't seen the film since lateSeptember when I visited Meryl in New York. I'm afraid if I see it now it'll be just as completely devastating as before. And I'm even more scared that it might not have that impact on me any more.

I *am* going to see the film on Oscar night though. That's a promise and one I mean to keep!

« Last Edit: December 15, 2006, 04:38:35 pm by Mikaela »

Offline nakymaton

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Re: "If your can't fix it, Jack...You gotta stand it."
« Reply #13 on: December 15, 2006, 04:32:31 pm »
You know, the exchange could be about society's rules... but "ain't no reins on this one" suggests something out of control, not rules that can't be broken. I imagine, I dunno, maybe an unbroken horse being ridden bareback -- something that Ennis wants to keep under control, but simply can't.

It's just a devastatingly sad line when I think about it. I mean, love as this untamed thing that ought to be broken?  :'( :'( :'(

(Mikaela, I haven't watched the movie since August. I don't plan to watch it again, not even on Oscar night, I don't think. But we'll see -- I swore off LotR, but right now I'm trying to catch up with a very fun re-reading that's happening on livejournal. But it's easier for me to go back to a book than to a movie. Books are the things that ultimately stick around for me.)
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Offline Mikaela

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Re: "If your can't fix it, Jack...You gotta stand it."
« Reply #14 on: December 15, 2006, 04:52:14 pm »
Quote
"ain't no reins on this one" suggests something out of control, not rules that can't be broken. I imagine, I dunno, maybe an unbroken horse being ridden bareback -- something that Ennis wants to keep under control, but simply can't.

Yes, that's exactly the way I see this. And after all, the exchange takes place very soon after the reunion kiss - out in the open, "out of control". That he could behave like that must baffle and scare Ennis. He didn't intend to let go of the reins on his self-control, but suddenly they just weren't there. A struggle between lust and caution where for once his caution and self-control didn't win out. (I just can't help using those exact words here, I think it's so strange that Ang Lee's current film is actually titled Lust, Caution).


Mel, I must be honest enough to say that it seems I'm slowly winding down my BBM fan activity by now. And I've yet no wish to return to LotR.... that will take time. I just can't think of very much more to say re BBM. Fanfiction always is my last stage of fannishness and by now even the BBM fanfiction sector is moving towards that clique&wank&drama stage that has nothing to do with appreciation and consideration of canon, and which sends me scampering far away. So....  :-\

Offline Jeff Wrangler

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Re: "If your can't fix it, Jack...You gotta stand it."
« Reply #15 on: December 15, 2006, 05:44:11 pm »
The trailer's what led me to the story and then to the film. Couldn't begin to say how many times I watched the trailer while waiting for the film's release. Never caught the change in that line, though.

Here's a link:
http://www.focusfeatures.com/viewer.php?f=brokeback_mountain&c=trailer&ext=wmv&w=480&&h=270

OMG, that's as beautiful as the film itself. ...  :'(

Funny thing, though. You could take the clips in the order they are presented in that trailer and concoct yourself an entirely different story or plot.  :-\ (Of course, they didn't want to give away the movie in the trailer.)
"It is required of every man that the spirit within him should walk abroad among his fellow-men, and travel far and wide."--Charles Dickens.

Offline Jeff Wrangler

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Re: "If your can't fix it, Jack...You gotta stand it."
« Reply #16 on: December 15, 2006, 06:05:08 pm »
And much as I prefer to hear it the other way, I can't entirely blot that possibility out of my mind. Jeff, is that the way you used to interpret the scene before you changed your views?

Tell you what, Katherine, until for some reason that I cannot explain this scene hit me like a ton of bricks back in August, to the best of my recollection my focus on this scene was limited to the similarities and differences between the story's motel scene and the film's motel-and-camping scene.

As a matter of fact, I might as well say it, at the risk of upsetting a lot of people, but getting slammed by this scene back in August has pretty much changed my entire emotional response to the film. I won't say I see it as less tragic, because that wouldn't be correct, but I now do see it as less--I don't know--operatic (?)--in the intensity of its emotions. And hand in hand with that, Film Ennis now looks more like Story Ennis to me than he did six months ago. I can't explain it, I just know this to be how I'm feeling.

And then again, I am hoping this Sunday evening to make the time to watch the DVD again. By calendar date, Sunday is one day shy of the first time I saw the film in the theater. And who knows but that something else will hit me like that proverbial ton of bricks and my understanding will change again.  :-\

In any case, as far as what is meant by the "ain't no reins on this one" comment, if I'm understanding them correctly, I agree with Mel and Mikaela. I think Ennis is talking about his (their?) emotions, rather than about society's rules. I think the intensity of the feeling that caused him to slam Jack up against a wall and kiss him outdoors in broad daylight scares the piss out of him (to use an Ennisism  ;D ).
"It is required of every man that the spirit within him should walk abroad among his fellow-men, and travel far and wide."--Charles Dickens.

Offline Jeff Wrangler

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Re: "If your can't fix it, Jack...You gotta stand it."
« Reply #17 on: December 15, 2006, 06:09:26 pm »
"It is required of every man that the spirit within him should walk abroad among his fellow-men, and travel far and wide."--Charles Dickens.

Offline Brown Eyes

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Re: "If your can't fix it, Jack...You gotta stand it."
« Reply #18 on: December 15, 2006, 11:03:48 pm »
Jeff, your discussion about changing emotional response to the film over all these months is really interesting.  I think as we go along and these discussions continue to evolve, we'll all begin to notice really big shifts in emotional response.  I sort of miss the early days... I mean in terms of my own emotional response.  I feel like I may have come to a point where I've analyzed and discussed the film so much that it's hard to access the truly raw emotional response I had in the early days.  I've deliberately forced myself not to watch the film for quite a while and I also haven't re-read the story for quite a long time to try to counter-act some of this (I know that someday soon this little BBM fast will come to an end... I'm feeling very itchy to watch the movie again... maybe tomorrow night  ;) ).  Sadly, this has caused some of my facts-at-fingertips type response to also slip when thinking about some of the analytical topics around here.  Anyway...  I love the film /story exactly as much as I always have, but in very different terms now (I think this is inevitable now that BBM is forever linked in my life experience to BetterMost, etc.).  This is off-topic, I know, but it seems important to bring up a bit here.  I know we've all discussed this scene (probably quite a lot) in other threads... again, it's just interesting to guage where we all are in our response to it after so much close discussion.

Anyway, back on topic a bit... I wonder how much of an understanding of this scene has to do with interpreting/translating Ennis-ese into more comprehensible terms and how much has to do with deeply personal responses to the scene by each individual viewer (and a bit to do with what we want Ennis to be saying here).  A key, and yes endlessly ambiguous question here, is how much of this is comprehensible to Jack as he's listening (or how do we guage his interpretation of Ennis's oblique statements here)?
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Offline nakymaton

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Re: "If your can't fix it, Jack...You gotta stand it."
« Reply #19 on: December 15, 2006, 11:23:24 pm »
A key, and yes endlessly ambiguous question here, is how much of this is comprehensible to Jack as he's listening (or how do we guage his interpretation of Ennis's oblique statements here)?

That little cheek-stroke is really very tender and intimate. At that moment, at least, Jack seems to sympathize.
Watch out. That poster has a low startle point.