the Earl flashback

[Brown Eyes]

I have a simple question about the depiction of the horrifying flashback of Ennis's Dad walking Ennis and his brother to see Earl's corpse.  Is that landscape actually Death Valley?  I've never been there, but I've seen pictures of Death Valley that look very much like that scenery.   

I wonder this because everytime I see that scene I think of the phrase "the valley of death."  Awful, awful.
 

[bbm_stitchbuffyfan]

I am not actually sure but I don't think so. I thought the movie was filmed entirely in Calgary. Anyone know off-hand what the credits say?

[ednbarby]

Sorry to be a bit OT, here, but I just have to say wasn't the boy who played the young Ennis *perfect* in that scene?  His features (especially his eyes) were a spot-on match, and the acting was superb.  The boy playing A.E. did very well too in the brief shot of him - all very believable reactions.  My husband has mentioned a couple times now that he was really impressed with how they shot that scene - how you saw just enough of Earl - really only a glimpse - and you knew enough from Ennis' gut-wrenching description - to grasp the full horror of what happened to Earl and what happened to Ennis.  He appreciated that it wasn't played out for shock value - that none of the movie was.  Gotta agree with him there.

[Brown Eyes]

This is such a hard scene to even talk about, but it really is well-done and just incredibly powerful.  I think it's interesting that Ennis's father remains anonymous, seen mostly from the back... like some dreadful force luring the children to see this horrible crime scene. 

The landscape seems way more ominous, bleak and forbiding than a simple "irrigation ditch".  That's what led to my question about the location.

I'm increasingly struck by the possiblity that Ennis's father may be a murderer.  At least it's clear that Ennis suspects this of his father.  It's hard to imagine the psychological trauma of not only knowing that his own father is such a vicious homophobe but also having the awful suspicion that his Dad might be a murderer.  And to top it off he then becomes an orphan before any possible justice could be brought to his father (at least he'll never know for sure what happened... no closure) and losing his mother whom we can suspect was a nice Mom (the humming and reminiscing about his mother in the flashback scene with Jack might lead to this idea). 

No wonder Ennis had trouble expressing himself.  He's almost too much of a tragic figure.  I'm not surprised that they left the detail about his semi-abusive brother out of the film even though that circumstance is discussed in the book. 

 

[Rayn]

I have a simple question about the depiction of the horrifying flashback of Ennis's Dad walking Ennis and his brother to see Earl's corpse.  Is that landscape actually Death Valley? 

I've been to Death Valley, driven and hiked around there and it doesn't look like the scene of "The Earl flashback."  The movie credits say filming was done in Canada, but also New Mexico, and it looks to be there. 

I myself thought if looked like North Dakota or Wyoming maybe, but I don't think any filming was done there, so I would bet on New Mexico.   Yes, the scene is well done; very powerful and horrifying.

Rayn

[starboardlight]

This is such a hard scene to even talk about, but it really is well-done and just incredibly powerful.  I think it's interesting that Ennis's father remains anonymous, seen mostly from the back... like some dreadful force luring the children to see this horrible crime scene. 

The landscape seems way more ominous, bleak and forbiding than a simple "irrigation ditch".  That's what led to my question about the location.

I'm increasingly struck by the possiblity that Ennis's father may be a murderer.  At least it's clear that Ennis suspects this of his father.  It's hard to imagine the psychological trauma of not only knowing that his own father is such a vicious homophobe but also having the awful suspicion that his Dad might be a murderer.  And to top it off he then becomes an orphan before any possible justice could be brought to his father (at least he'll never know for sure what happened... no closure) and losing his mother whom we can suspect was a nice Mom (the humming and reminiscing about his mother in the flashback scene with Jack might lead to this idea). 

No wonder Ennis had trouble expressing himself.  He's almost too much of a tragic figure.  I'm not surprised that they left the detail about his semi-abusive brother out of the film even though that circumstance is discussed in the book. 

 

yeah, for Ennis it's not just the trauma of this one event. He spent his entire childhood living with a man that's violent and homophobic, and may well be a murderer. He grew up in constant fear. No wonder the level of repression in him. Poor boy.

Not showing the father's face is interesting too. Often in film and art, anonymity is a symbol of generality. The anonymous character stands for everyone, for you, for me, for society in general. It's an interesting reading that it's not just the father, but it's society that is the cause of this trauma.

[serious crayons]

Not showing the father's face is interesting too. Often in film and art, anonymity is a symbol of generality. The anonymous character stands for everyone, for you, for me, for society in general. It's an interesting reading that it's not just the father, but it's society that is the cause of this trauma.

Good point, starboardlight!

With a potentially murderous father, no wonder Ennis is hotheaded and violent himself. Also, whether or not the dad actually killed Earl, the very fact that Ennis thinks he would have been capable of it says it all.

[moremojo]

I have a simple question about the depiction of the horrifying flashback of Ennis's Dad walking Ennis and his brother to see Earl's corpse.  Is that landscape actually Death Valley?  I've never been there, but I've seen pictures of Death Valley that look very much like that scenery.   

I wonder this because everytime I see that scene I think of the phrase "the valley of death."  Awful, awful.
 

I think almost all the film was shot on location in the province of Alberta, in Canada, though Rayn mentions some New Mexico shooting also, and the scenery looks more consistent with New Mexico (which I have visited) than with what I picture of Alberta (which I know only from photographs and films).

It should also be borne in mind that the setting for this scene is somewhere around Sage, near the Utah border. The scenery definitely looks like parts of Utah I have passed through, so the selection of the site for shooting seems well chosen.

I remember composing a haiku inspired by this scene. If I can find it again, or remember it, I'll post it in this thread.

Scott

[moremojo]

Here is the haiku I wrote inspired by the Earl flashback:

Mouth gaping, blood red
Staining desert sage gully
Love's terrible price.

[Brown Eyes]

starlightboard, I also like the idea that the anonymous father stands for society in general.  Wow, that's awfully bleak though. 
 

In a very uncomfortable way I wonder what, if anything, this scene means to Ennis's empty threat to Jack about "killing" him if he finds out about "all those things" he doesn't know about.  I'll make clear here that I truly don't believe Ennis meant anything real by saying that, and obviously Ennis (as a sweet, overly sensitive guy) is nothing like his dad.  But, it's a very disturbing thing for Ennis to even utter given the idea that he believes that his own father may have murdered a gay man.