Author Topic: lovable subtle details  (Read 338963 times)

Offline Sason

  • BetterMost Moderator
  • The BetterMost 10,000 Post Club
  • *****
  • Posts: 12,051
  • Bork bork bork
Re: lovable subtle details
« Reply #620 on: January 06, 2015, 03:33:06 pm »
There are a lot of threads I love here (you should see how many browser windows I currently have open!!) but this is by far my favorite. It has given me reason to watch this achingly devastatingly beautiful movie yet again.

Tell you what, I don't know what I'd do without Bettermost, because I am literally the only one I know personally that has been turned inside out by BBM.

Anyway, I had noticed a few of the LSDs already mentioned here, but there are a couple I haven't seen as yet in the thread:

1) The fact that BOTH Jack and Ennis end up dancing with women they may like but not love to "No One's Gonna Love You Like Me". I didn't realize this until I downloaded the soundtrack onto my phone and pulled an Ennis. "Hunh? Why's this one here twice?" Rewatched movie. Figured it out. Duh.

2) In the Twist Thanksgiving scene, Jack puts his hand on Lureen's back after he turns the TV off and heads back to the table. My husband and I do this kind of as a way of saying, "I've got your back on this one," and leads me to believe that they may not have been soul mates but Jack respected Lureen enough to back her up when came to parenting Bobby.

3) It's a very short scene, but I LOVE LOVE LOVE when Jack lets little Bobby drive the combine and yells, "No hands!" Both Jack and Ennis are almost literally suffocating under the weight each carries, but they really do make efforts to be present as fathers despite having both had poor relationships with their own fathers. Choosing in some small way to not be the kind of fathers they had

4) In one of the bar scenes with Cassie, it took me several viewings to realize that when the Allman Brothers' "Melissa" came on, it was just after Ennis was at the jukebox. Was this the song Ennis chose? Had he heard it before and had it resonated with him? It certainly describes him to a T. I'm quite sad that song didn't make it onto the soundtrack.

5) I know it's been mentioned that Ennis winks at Jack during the 'prayer of thanks' scene. I just love the relaxed, happy look on Ennis' face. We get to see it so rarely, it's such a treat when it's there. There are a couple other winks too, so well-timed I don't think they're coincidental. A second one when Ennis arrives at camp just after Jack's blue parka scene. As soon as he gets out of his truck it's there. They're so happy to see each other. I love it. And the third during their last night together when Jack says he'll probably get shot by Lureen or the husband, and Ennis says, "You probably deserve it." There's a little wink there.  I don't know what to make of that last wink.

Tons of subtlety and detail that just makes the story that much more heartbreaking. As has been mentioned in so many places here and elsewhere, Jake and Heath's ability (and to an extent Anne and Michelle's) to convey a whole story with the slightest change in expression - just brilliant. I love these actors, these characters, and this story.

Lots of interesting observations here, CDT.

The experience of being the only person you know to have this gut punch by BBM, you share with most of us.

We were all alone in the beginning, having nobody around us to share the experience or even talk about it with.

Since then many Brokies have met in RL and become friends, but in the beginning forums like BM was the only way to meet likeminded people.

Glad you found us. I don't know what I'd do if I hadn't found people to share it with when I was totally devastated at the peak of BBM fever.

Düva pööp is a förce of natüre

Offline dontinterrupt

  • Jr. Ranch Hand
  • **
  • Posts: 34
Re: lovable subtle details
« Reply #621 on: January 13, 2015, 07:32:54 pm »
I totally understand that feeling of isolation and not knowing anyone who was just as affected by this story as I was. To add to my pain, I seem to have watched this movie 9 years too late (first viewing june 2014), after majority of its fandom kinda...dissipated.
As to lovable moments of the movie...I doubt this hasn't been mentioned yet, but it absolutely melts me to the bone when Ennis sends Jack these brief subtle looks of absolute and utter affection - e.g. just after "you'll run them sheep off again if you don't quiet down" and "well, you probably deserve it". It truly sums up everything Ennis feels, but can never say. At the same time, I love how these looks are being sent after some -also rare- carefree teasing on Ennis's part - uber cute

Another lovable part for me is the scene when Junior visits Ennis in his trailer, when you can clearly see a few times how much Ennis is still gripped by grief (his absent look out the window when Alma Jr says Kurt loves her) and when he makes hints only he understands (and probably wishes he could share with somebody someday), such as "when you got nothing, you don't need nothing" and "I guess you're 19, you can do whatever you want, is that right?" (am I the only one who sees more than just smalltalk in this question?)

Offline coffeedrinkintexan

  • Sr. Ranch Hand
  • ***
  • Posts: 104
  • Sweet beautiful Jack, sweet beautiful Ennis
Re: lovable subtle details
« Reply #622 on: January 13, 2015, 10:27:10 pm »
I totally understand that feeling of isolation and not knowing anyone who was just as affected by this story as I was. To add to my pain, I seem to have watched this movie 9 years too late (first viewing june 2014), after majority of its fandom kinda...dissipated.
As to lovable moments of the movie...I doubt this hasn't been mentioned yet, but it absolutely melts me to the bone when Ennis sends Jack these brief subtle looks of absolute and utter affection - e.g. just after "you'll run them sheep off again if you don't quiet down" and "well, you probably deserve it". It truly sums up everything Ennis feels, but can never say. At the same time, I love how these looks are being sent after some -also rare- carefree teasing on Ennis's part - uber cute

Another lovable part for me is the scene when Junior visits Ennis in his trailer, when you can clearly see a few times how much Ennis is still gripped by grief (his absent look out the window when Alma Jr says Kurt loves her) and when he makes hints only he understands (and probably wishes he could share with somebody someday), such as "when you got nothing, you don't need nothing" and "I guess you're 19, you can do whatever you want, is that right?" (am I the only one who sees more than just smalltalk in this question?)
dontinterrupt, we are in the same boat. I saw it for the first time October 2014 and too many times to count since. Still just as gripping now as it was the first time. I'm with you, friend.

You are absolutely not the only one who sees more than smalltalk in that last scene between Ennis and Jr. It's absolutely clear (to me, anyway) that he's thinking of Jack when he asks Jr. if Kurt loves her. It's almost like you can hear him thinking as he's looking out the window, "Somebody loved me when I was 19, too...."

If only, as he said to his daughter, he could've done what he wanted at 19.....

Rips my heart to pieces every time.  :'(
"You got a better idea?"   "I did once."

Offline dontinterrupt

  • Jr. Ranch Hand
  • **
  • Posts: 34
Re: lovable subtle details
« Reply #623 on: January 14, 2015, 04:59:51 pm »
CDT, thanks for your reply, it's really great after reading this forum for months and seeing majority of its topics abandoned for years, to see that there are still some people out there! For me personally, BBM was the first movie that I just couldn't get enough of, couldn't stop watching, reading all about it. Hell, I live in the UK and I visited The Autry in LA just to see The Shirts live *freak alert* *totally worth it*
Sorry to go totally off topic though, I am new to this forum and still don't know exactly what I should say where :)
Another tiny lovable moment of the movie for me was during the reunion scene at the motel. Ennis says "Didn't think I'd hear from ya again" and Jack kind of exhales in his hair with an "aaah" sound. Did anyone notice it? Like a sigh of disbelief at the notion of not writing to Ennis eventually. As if he was saying "Yeah, like that could ever happen". I love it, I love everything about that scene. Though gotta say, I wish Ennis in that scene was more like the OS Ennis, actually SAYING something. In Jack's (OS) word's: "Come on, give me somethin to go on, this ain't no little thing that's happenin here!"

Offline coffeedrinkintexan

  • Sr. Ranch Hand
  • ***
  • Posts: 104
  • Sweet beautiful Jack, sweet beautiful Ennis
Re: lovable subtle details
« Reply #624 on: January 14, 2015, 08:10:40 pm »
Sorry to go totally off topic though, I am new to this forum and still don't know exactly what I should say where :)
Another tiny lovable moment of the movie for me was during the reunion scene at the motel. Ennis says "Didn't think I'd hear from ya again" and Jack kind of exhales in his hair with an "aaah" sound. Did anyone notice it? Like a sigh of disbelief at the notion of not writing to Ennis eventually. As if he was saying "Yeah, like that could ever happen". I love it, I love everything about that scene. Though gotta say, I wish Ennis in that scene was more like the OS Ennis, actually SAYING something. In Jack's (OS) word's: "Come on, give me somethin to go on, this ain't no little thing that's happenin here!"
I love that whole motel scene. A lot of times I'll watch it once and focus totally on Ennis' face, then rewatch it and focus totally on Jack. There are a ton of details that if you're watching one, you'll miss on the other. Heath and Jake played that scene (and so many others) just spot-on.

I keep thinking of other LSDs at random moments through the day then when I get on here to post, they are all gone. Brain farts, I suppose.



"You got a better idea?"   "I did once."

Offline dontinterrupt

  • Jr. Ranch Hand
  • **
  • Posts: 34
Re: lovable subtle details
« Reply #625 on: January 15, 2015, 05:26:47 pm »
LSD= love that abbreviation <3
I love that whole motel scene. A lot of times I'll watch it once and focus totally on Ennis' face, then rewatch it and focus totally on Jack. There are a ton of details that if you're watching one, you'll miss on the other.




So true! I do that quite a lot (I still can't get over the fact that I can freely say this stuff to someone and not feel like a total freak for it!) - and that motel scene is one of the deeper ones expression-wise. For example, the rapid change in Ennis's facial expression when Jack asks "what are we gonna do now?"- like it just struck and destroyed him all over again how much of a hopeless situation they're in. And he doesn't even need to say a word- it's all written in his eyes. God, his eyes in certain moments just make me wanna cry for an hour and then go through that screen, give him a hug, stroke his hair and say "shh...s'alright..."
Nope, still feels a little bit freaky to say this!  I guess I'm still in the "i ain't queer" stage if you know what I mean ;)

Offline Sason

  • BetterMost Moderator
  • The BetterMost 10,000 Post Club
  • *****
  • Posts: 12,051
  • Bork bork bork
Re: lovable subtle details
« Reply #626 on: February 03, 2015, 06:45:34 pm »
I'm loving the exchange here.

Please keep it coming, CDT and dontinterrupt!

You may not get a lot of replies from other forum members who are past that stage of Brokiedom, but I for one love to read it.

I kinda miss the raw emotions and obsession with these details from my early Brokie years.

Düva pööp is a förce of natüre

Offline coffeedrinkintexan

  • Sr. Ranch Hand
  • ***
  • Posts: 104
  • Sweet beautiful Jack, sweet beautiful Ennis
Re: lovable subtle details
« Reply #627 on: February 03, 2015, 10:07:53 pm »
Thank you, Sason!  :-*   I have really wanted to sneak in another viewing here lately....to get more of those LSDs.

Grad school has been really overwhelming in terms of both time and emotional energy so I find myself with so little left over at the end of the day. And it's too emotionally shattering to watch without free time at the end to cry and then pull myself together and move on.

But one little thing I just love (even though it's not a very happy scene) is when Ennis complains, "I can't believe I left my damn shirt up there."

Jake plays/Jack responds *exactly* the way I respond when I've come *thisclose* to getting busted at something....kids almost find the Christmas present hiding spot, husband starts asking questions when I'm trying to plan a surprise for him...

....the "Oh-God-try-to-stay-cool-and-say-something-without-giving-it-away", so you just say, "yeah....". His facial expression is just perfect there.
"You got a better idea?"   "I did once."

Offline dontinterrupt

  • Jr. Ranch Hand
  • **
  • Posts: 34
Re: lovable subtle details
« Reply #628 on: February 15, 2015, 12:06:41 am »
aw, thanks, Sason :)
so here's another LSD I lately began to appreciate:
Fishing trip post the thanksgiving drama scene. The one with "God damn Jack-Fucking-Twist, got it all figured out, don't ya" (BTW: how harsh!).
Rewind a little bit to the moment when Jack says "Well, maybe you oughta get out of there, you know? Find yourself some place different, maybe Texas?". Note how Jack's tone and behaviour are so blatantly uncertain, really emphasising how insecure (almost scared) he still is after all these years, to be mentioning anything that even vaguely hints them getting together. He even tries to fake nonchalance when saying this, with the pauses and the shrug, but it really only highlights it. And then when Ennis starts to ridicule him with the sarcastic remark of adopting the girls with Lureen, this insecurity is confirmed again along with something else definitely present there when he just looks at Ennis defeat in his eyes, blinks a few times, then tilts his head (look closely, it lasts but a few seconds), as Ennis finishes his tirade. His "Go to hell, Ennis Del Mar" sums all these feelings up - resentful, quiet, voice breaking, then quickly replaced by anger.
Did you see that too? It's such an underrated scene!... Or am I overanalysing?  ???

Offline Penthesilea

  • Town Administration
  • The BetterMost 10,000 Post Club
  • *****
  • Posts: 14,684
Re: lovable subtle details
« Reply #629 on: February 15, 2015, 04:17:01 am »
Did you see that too? It's such an underrated scene!... Or am I overanalysing?  ???


Yes, I did. And no, you're not at all overanalyzing; you described it very well.
Jack's attempt on hiding his motives is pretty clumsy and Ennis easily sees through it. I can understand Ennis' strong reaction. E opens up to J, talks about his insecurities, his angst, about their situation (and I bet he wasn't often willing to do that!) and J brushes E's anxieties aside in one big swoop: just move to Texas, everything will be fine. As if Tx were so much more progressive and easy going. And no thought whatsoever about E's daughters. Easy to say for Jack. But of course, seeing poor Jack being put down so harshly is sad, too.


Like Sonja (Sason) already said, and as you can see here in Open Forum, we led these discussions of minuscule details over several years. Talk about excessive. ;D ;)
But for us this phase of being a Brokie is also years ago meanwhile. Don't get disheartened when you get only few new replies. Like Sonja, I also read and enjoy what you two add here, even if I don't join the discussion. And I think Sonja and I are not the only ones. Keep it up. :)