Author Topic: Annie Proulx's still pissed...  (Read 79916 times)

injest

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Re: Annie Proulx's still pissed...
« Reply #70 on: May 05, 2009, 06:59:22 pm »
Probably not.  But I agree with that lawyer that there is a credible defense of the erotic stories that they are social commentary and serve as criticism

most moral people understand there are MANY things that are legal that are STILL rude and inconsiderate...and should not be done.

injest

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Re: Annie Proulx's still pissed...
« Reply #71 on: May 05, 2009, 07:20:19 pm »
Copyright and other laws protecting inventions and intellectual properties exist for good reasons. Non-inventors may feel it's their right to capitalize on someone else's creativity and hard work, but that is a misguided perception. 'Exploring characters further' makes no sense; fanfiction is attempting to alter and reinvent characters it has no right to touch. If anyone wants to 'explore', read another book in which the character(s) is featured; if there are none, that is just unfortunate, and one is left to studying the original work itself.

Plus, the limited perusing of BM fanfiction I have seen is obviously attempts at making male-to-male sexual interests and situations more open and seedy...miles away from anything AP had in mind. For some reason, fanfiction writers appear to be titilated by the freedom to use words and situations previously somewhat taboo outside of closed circles; using situations they often know nothing about. To that I suspect AP would say "get over yourself" and leave my characters alone. And I agree with her.

witness the orgasmic joy over the phrase "teabagging"...the giggly jr high "did you hear what that means!!"

I know I was turned off writing fan fic after reading some of the 'art' presented by others...

Offline SFEnnisSF

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Re: Annie Proulx's still pissed...
« Reply #72 on: May 05, 2009, 09:44:15 pm »
This isn't about which fan fic was this or that, right or wrong, etc.  No one ever said anyone had to read anyone else's Fan Fiction.  If you weren't interested in it, then simply don't read it. 

This is about Annie getting some letters from a few folks who saw the movie "Brokeback Mountain" and then "critiqued" it.  And now she goes on this tyrade about it with this blanket statment saying we all mis-interpreted it and we're all wrong and she now feels she shouldn't have written it?

Sorry Brad, but inmaturity (your word) goes both ways...  When you talk down to your fans who were touched and moved by your work like that, you'll get it right back to ya.  Call it what you want, it's human nature.  Respectfullness can go a long way....

Offline louisev

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Re: Annie Proulx's still pissed...
« Reply #73 on: May 05, 2009, 09:46:28 pm »
I'm with Eric here, it is fruitless and disturbing to readers and fans for an author who has published and made a great deal of money off a publication to make a statement like wishing she never wrote it.  But there have always been artists who have a love/hate relationship with their fans.
“Mr. Coyote always gets me good, boy,”  Ellery said, winking.  “Almost forgot what life was like before I got me my own personal coyote.”


Offline Jeff Wrangler

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Re: Annie Proulx's still pissed...
« Reply #74 on: May 05, 2009, 10:14:18 pm »
I'm with Eric here, it is fruitless and disturbing to readers and fans for an author who has published and made a great deal of money off a publication to make a statement like wishing she never wrote it.  But there have always been artists who have a love/hate relationship with their fans.

(Shrugs) Doesn't bother me in the least. As I've said already, my sympathies are all with Annie. I'm sure she had--or has--days when it seems like "Brokeback"/Brokeback has taken over her life, and she feels heartily sick of it. I understand the feeling and I don't hold it against her. But I agree, there always have been artists who have a love/hate relationship with their fans.
"It is required of every man that the spirit within him should walk abroad among his fellow-men, and travel far and wide."--Charles Dickens.

Offline Monika

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Re: Annie Proulx's still pissed...
« Reply #75 on: May 05, 2009, 10:34:04 pm »
Copyright and other laws protecting inventions and intellectual properties exist for good reasons. Non-inventors may feel it's their right to capitalize on someone else's creativity and hard work, 
there is no money involved in fan fiction  O0

Offline SFEnnisSF

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Re: Annie Proulx's still pissed...
« Reply #76 on: May 05, 2009, 10:38:05 pm »
I think Annie is upset with the situation and maybe herself perhaps.  

She wrote this story with "open spaces" in it, for the "readers to bring their own experiences to it" and to "finish the story themselves".  

It seems that *some* of the interpretations of the story and/or movie that some folks have shared with her are not to her liking.  But who's fault is that?  She deliberately left it open for interpretation!

Where was she when the movie came out?  She refused interviews.  She didn't want to talk to reporters.  She didn't want to elaborate on the story.  IMO, if she had been more vocal during the release of the movie, and perhaps gave some interviews and elaborated on the story and it's meaning (the destructive effects of homophobia), then maybe perhaps she wouldn't have gotten letters from "men" telling her how her story should be different.  ;)  But, where was she?  Hmmmm?  I think her silence about the movie and story during the movie's release actually hurt it (the message she was tryin' to get across) in some ways.  It did leave it open to "fantasy pornish re-writes" if that's where some folks wanted to take it...

So, what can she do about it now?  How about this Annie?  Instead of going on temper tantrum tyrades and generalizing that we all "got it wrong", how about replying to these "men" who sent you their versions of the story, and constructively explaining to them and elaborating to them why the story and movie is the way it is.  How about talking more to the press and holding book discussion/movie screenings and elaborating on exactly what the "destructive effects of rural homophobia" are, and discussing why you wrote the story the way you did and why the movie the way it is.  Perhaps then Annie, the re-writes of your story will stop coming to you...

She could choose to actively do something constructive and positive here (even though she missed the opportunity to do so when the movie was fresh out in the theatres and all a buzz), or she can sit there and continue to complain about it and be upset about it....

Offline Monika

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Re: Annie Proulx's still pissed...
« Reply #77 on: May 05, 2009, 10:40:19 pm »


Plus, the limited perusing of BM fanfiction I have seen is obviously attempts at making male-to-male sexual interests and situations more open and seedy...miles away from anything AP had in mind. For some reason, fanfiction writers appear to be titilated by the freedom to use words and situations previously somewhat taboo outside of closed circles; using situations they often know nothing about. To that I suspect AP would say "get over yourself" and leave my characters alone. And I agree with her.
 Like I said, the purpose of fan fiction is not neccessarily to explore what AP had in mind.

"Using situations they know nothing about"

You mean fiction has to be self-lived to be relevant? Well bye bye sci-fiction O0  Without fantasy there wouldn´t be much fiction out there for anyone to read. You want self-lived you should go for non-fiction


But the purpose of this thread is not to discuss fan fiction in general. I think AP is mainly upset about the fact that she´s gotten a lot of stories sent to her. And I think she has every right to be annoyed by that.

Offline Monika

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Re: Annie Proulx's still pissed...
« Reply #78 on: May 05, 2009, 11:01:36 pm »
I mean that unless a writer knows his/her subject, even fiction is not going to work. If you are under the impression that successful sci fi writers are not deeply aware of the science behind their stories, rots a ruck.


A lot of fan fiction involves techniques not yet invented, or have characters visit other worlds of which there is hard to have any knowledge of.

The foundation of fiction is fantasy and an interest in human relationships.

Offline SFEnnisSF

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Re: Annie Proulx's still pissed...
« Reply #79 on: May 05, 2009, 11:05:29 pm »
Hmmmm. Not sure why AP needs to do that sort of reach out to anyone. She created a work, she sold it, and that is that. It may be nice if she accomdated her readers' wants and needs and desires, but i think holding her to that level of expectation is not fair. And why should she be obliged to extend herself to such heights in order to defray the type of actions and behaviors she should be guaranteed anyway? She's an author, not a volunteer social worker.

No one said she *had* to do anything.  It was a suggestion friend.  But, then she needs to stop sitting there and bitching and complaining then.