Author Topic: P.O. Boxes, Mailboxes and the No. 17  (Read 41921 times)

Offline nakymaton

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Re: P.O. Boxes, Mailboxes and the No. 17
« Reply #30 on: August 16, 2006, 12:40:51 pm »
It's lucky for Ennis, though, because then he would never have found out...

Would he have shown up in November and waited in vain for Jack? Would he assume Jack had quit him? Would he call the house in Childress to find out what happened?
Oh.  :'( :'( :'( It hurts to even think about that... to imagine Ennis going to the post office every day, hoping for a postcard, and never getting another one, and not knowing why. Given that movie-Ennis had never called Childress before, and given how things were left after their last meeting -- and given that Ennis apparently dumps Cassie by simply not responding to her notes -- I would guess that Ennis would eventually decide that Jack had quit him.  :'( :'( :'( Maybe not until Ennis had sent many more postcards, until November had come and gone. But, oh, ouch, that just hurts to think about. Jack dying is bad enough; Jack dying PLUS Ennis never finding the shirts, or hearing that Jack wanted his ashes spread on Brokeback Mountain because it was his favorite place?   :'( :'( :'( At least the movie ends with Ennis knowing how much he was loved...
Watch out. That poster has a low startle point.

Offline Front-Ranger

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Re: P.O. Boxes, Mailboxes and the No. 17
« Reply #31 on: August 16, 2006, 12:58:34 pm »
Yes, thank God for the shirts.  :-\
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Offline serious crayons

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Re: P.O. Boxes, Mailboxes and the No. 17
« Reply #32 on: August 16, 2006, 01:09:15 pm »
I'll third that.

And Mel, as for the other part of your post, that's why I can't subscribe to the idea that Jack decided to quit Ennis after their last trip and that was that. I think he would have had to show up in November. And by then, maybe Ennis would have made some changes. Or Jack might have lost his resolve.

It's amazing how after all this time I keep grasping for any way I can think of to make the story a tiny bit less sad ...

 :'(

Offline Brown Eyes

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Re: P.O. Boxes, Mailboxes and the No. 17
« Reply #33 on: August 17, 2006, 12:28:18 am »
Yes, thank God for the shirts.  :-\

Yes, of course, thank god for the shirts!  But, it keeps occurring to me that in addition to the shirts (and the handful of other encouraging things that happen after Jack's death... like the "I swear", etc.) the hug we see at the end of the argument before the flashback is essential.  If we didn't see that little touch of reconciliation at the end of that pretty harsh argument, I think the movie would take on a whole different level of sad.  Thinking that the last contact that they had with each other involved only yelling at each other and then driving away mad, would be impossible to take.
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Offline jpwagoneer1964

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Re: P.O. Boxes, Mailboxes and the No. 17
« Reply #34 on: August 17, 2006, 12:36:25 am »
Yes, of course, thank god for the shirts!  But, it keeps occurring to me that in addition to the shirts (and the handful of other encouraging things that happen after Jack's death... like the "I swear", etc.) the hug we see at the end of the argument before the flashback is essential.  If we didn't see that little touch of reconciliation at the end of that pretty harsh argument, I think the movie would take on a whole different level of sad.  Thinking that the last contact that they had with each other involved only yelling at each other and then driving away mad, would be impossible to take.
the book and the 2003 screenplay are without that so important embrace. thankyou Ang.
It's also important that we know without even seeing it that Jack would stay with Ennis as long taking as much time as he needed until Ennis was able to leave.
« Last Edit: August 17, 2006, 12:58:10 am by jpwagoneer1964 »
Thank you Heath and Jake for showing us Ennis and Jack,  teaching us how much they loved one another.

Offline serious crayons

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Re: P.O. Boxes, Mailboxes and the No. 17
« Reply #35 on: August 17, 2006, 12:55:04 am »
If we didn't see that little touch of reconciliation at the end of that pretty harsh argument, I think the movie would take on a whole different level of sad.  Thinking that the last contact that they had with each other involved only yelling at each other and then driving away mad, would be impossible to take.

Absolutely, and good point. Ennis' collapse and Jack's comforting is gut-wrenching, but without it I'd probably never be able to watch that scene at all. The other thing I cling to in that scene is Ennis' "I just can't stand it no more, Jack." It offers a shred of hope that Ennis will decide to change, and if nothing else reassures Jack that their situation is as torturous for Ennis as it is for him.

Toward the end of the final lake scene, as Jack and Ennis fiercely embrace, the full-screen version shows Jack’s feet. Tiny detail, I know, but seeing his feet against the ground, more of his legs against Ennis’s--it reinforces how tightly torqued together they are (sorry for the alliteration). It’s comforting to me.

Me too. Thanks, Barbara! That does help. Maybe we should start a thread of "shreds of hope" or "comforting moments" that help slightly lessen the pain.

On a different note, this is yet another situation when the full-screen version shows something the wide-screen doesn't (I can think of two others, and maybe there are more). Film buffs are always scoffing at full screens, aren't they? But in this case, at least, it seems better.

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Re: P.O. Boxes, Mailboxes and the No. 17
« Reply #36 on: August 17, 2006, 12:28:12 pm »
It has been pointed out that 7+1=8, possibly signifying August, the eighth month, the month that the two men "lost twice". But it also occurred to me that 7-1=6, which could suggest the sixth month of June, the approximate time when the boys first met in 1963.

Am I just grabbing at straws?

Offline dly64

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Re: P.O. Boxes, Mailboxes and the No. 17
« Reply #37 on: August 17, 2006, 02:14:16 pm »
OMG! I keep finding these threads and begin reading and next thing I know, I am enlightened on a completely new aspect of the film! I love all of the theories about the number “17” or 1+7 or 1-7. I never even considered the number as an issue, as for the mailbox, I believe it was Mel who mentioned that it was the PO where Ennis received the bad news about Jack’s death. That has always been my interpretation. Going back to the PO would be painful for Ennis.

As for full-screen versus wide-screen debate …  I am a film snob in that regard. I can’t buy a full-screen DVD because the composition of the entire shot is lost. However, my DVD player has a magnifier. So, when I want to check something out, I just use the magnifier and boom …. there it is!!  ;D So, I feel I have the best of both worlds!

Someone else mentioned the postcards Jack sent Ennis and if Ennis would have kept them. It is interesting that I, too, wondered why Ennis did not hang up one of Jack’s postcards. But, honestly, I doubt he saved them. If someone found them, there would be the whole “why” issue. And with Ennis’ fear of being “outted,”  I can’t imagine he would keep something that would pose those types of  questions.

Anyway … great thread, Amanda!
Diane

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Offline nakymaton

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Re: P.O. Boxes, Mailboxes and the No. 17
« Reply #38 on: August 17, 2006, 02:32:57 pm »
But it also occurred to me that 7-1=6, which could suggest the sixth month of June, the approximate time when the boys first met in 1963.

Am I just grabbing at straws?

Well, I'm not much of one for numeralogy, just because it gets awfully easy to make almost any point once you get going. But I've got to applaud any post that says that the boys met in June! ;D (That's been one of my little nit-picky things.)

And as for the postcards... I'm with the people who think that Ennis wouldn't have kept them, but Jack might have.

But that last card. Damn, that would have been hard to keep, and harder to throw away. (Even though Jack never touched it.  :'( )
« Last Edit: August 17, 2006, 02:34:31 pm by nakymaton »
Watch out. That poster has a low startle point.

Offline dly64

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Re: P.O. Boxes, Mailboxes and the No. 17
« Reply #39 on: September 07, 2006, 09:44:58 am »
I pulled this thread back up because I found the symbolic meanings of some of these numbers. I posted this on another board ... so this is what I said:

I have seen some posts on other forums regarding the number “17” on Ennis’ mailbox and what that might symbolize. First we see Ennis sticking on the “1” and then the “7”. I have done some perusing and I found these symbolic meanings for the numbers, “1” and “7”. I also looked up “8” since the “1” was put up first and then the “7” was added. Here is what I found … for what it’s worth!

One - clearly represents unity, primacy, the first, the best, the only, it has no divisors, no factors, no components, it is universal, whole and complete. One is independent of all other numbers, is the source of all other numbers.

Seven - is from a root word meaning to be complete or full.

Eight - is seven plus one, and is hence the start of a new order, the beginning of a new era. Eight thus represents regeneration and resurrection.

Interesting, huh?


I think that fits our guys pretty well. What do y'all think?
Diane

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